Lets have an Australia wide march in each capitol city

[littlbit]

Hey I think we are starting to get some great ideas now, perhaps the first thing we need to do is gather groups in and around each of our major cities where we can all sit down and discuss what is possible and what each of us is willing to do and more important is capable of doing. Now we are prepared to get people to our home, where we can talk in private not to mention it is easier to get a coffee etc if we hold it here and it could be fun too. So we are in South east burbs of Melbourne, anyone willing to join in can PM either myself or lightning. It would have to begin next month as we are booked for the next 2 weeks.

 

I will print out the ideas here, and see what everyone thinks about them and I think then we will put up what comes out of that group and if everyone does the same we can all work out what will work and what will not.

 

Just my thoughts, I am open to anything from anyone right now just to get this under way.

[mull]

High guys, happened upon this

 

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/other/dfat/tr...es/1967/31.html

 

which is likely an important place to begin.

 

Marches and cannabis public relations have been like pushing shit uphill with a chop stick since 67.

 

This treaty is why. It's basis was in control, bigotry, and hypocrisy (see alcohol and tobacco on it anyplace..)

 

Perhaps we also should look at ways of presenting the positive health aspects of cannabis and the negative health effects of cannabis prohibition, to the World Health Organization/ UN.

e.g. Making petty criminals out of normal people. WHO said that was healthy.

Filling jails with drug offenders whose lives and families have been ruined needlessly by prohibition. WHO said that was healthy to.

 

Even if we impress the public with the truth of cannabis and change perceptions about the plant and users (chop stick), our bureaucrats will still dance like puppets to the same old tune.. treaty.. and not to forget those with vested interests against cannabis prohibition repeal.

 

Today, where binge drinking is out of hand and anti depressants really aren't much better than placebos, cannabis is still way more efficient medicinally and recreationally, and WHO knows why its still illegal here

[Rocker]

Yes, I agree.

 

It seems to me the only hope of getting cannabis accepted in any way is via the medical route.

 

The medical benefits have to pushed and pushed hard.

 

Fair dinkum, if it can be proved that cannabis use leads to longivity it will be legal by next Christmas.

Okay, I wrote that in jest but that's what our crusade needs.

 

I have been 'around' cannabis since 1977 and we have lost an awful lot of ground over that thirty years.

Promoting the medical benefits of cannabis is the way to go.

It appears to have worked in California.

[mullray]

Yes, I agree.

 

It seems to me the only hope of getting cannabis accepted in any way is via the medical route.

 

The medical benefits have to pushed and pushed hard.

 

Fair dinkum, if it can be proved that cannabis use leads to longivity it will be legal by next Christmas.

Okay, I wrote that in jest but that's what our crusade needs.

 

I have been 'around' cannabis since 1977 and we have lost an awful lot of ground over that thirty years.

Promoting the medical benefits of cannabis is the way to go.

It appears to have worked in California.

 

I don't know old rocker, it's a tough sell all round given what has been happening and probably will remain happening for years to come. I think the med movement may in part be the cause of the problem. The bodies who want to see prohibition of all drugs remain in place see the mj movement as a direct threat because as it states in the World Drug Report:

 

No other drug has a movement that seeks to undermine the single narcotics convention as a whole. No other drug has been for intents and purposes legalised in some respects in some countries. No other drug undermines the convention more so than cannabis. (To this effect)

 

What the single narcotics convention states is just that. It is singular and all drugs are seen as the same within the convention. Cannabis has greatly undermined this convention and the UN WDR 2006 makes calls to unify and ratify the convention with special attention being paid to cannabis in this report. I believe what we are seeing now is a politically motivated and concerted attack on the legalisation movement with med cannabis being a key target. While the states in the US have been lenient on med cannabis the Federal Government has been ruthless in attacking the states for their med cannabis policies; so while it is pseudo legal you may also find yourself busted by federal US authorities.

 

 

In a sense what we are seeing now is the prohibition movement kicking back against the legalisation movement. Trace this latest series of events and you will find it stems mostly from the US Federal Government who targeted the Canadian scene through the INCB (a neutral UN body - yeah right) around 2000. Look at the action that has taken place since - it's formidable, ruthless and has been highly successful This stinks of the US and it also smells of collusion between them and global policing bodies.

 

Holland now has shifted their views. Icons of the Canadian scene have been arrested and the Canadian Government are becoming less and less tolerant, icons in the US scene have been arrested (Ed Rosenthal and Eddie Chong?) the UK has been attacked by UN bodies (The WHO and the INCB - 2 independent UN bodies - yeah right) and are about to repeal their downgrade on mj (very likely at a political level) and in general we've seen incredible amounts of busts globally - not just localised to Australia.

 

My bet is that the med movement is the last stand but it will fall within the next decade if current policy prevails. I don't like to be the prophet of doom but read the trends, watch the numbers and you can only come to one conclusion.

 

I think that we need to be arguing for the legalisation of all drugs on the basis that while they are in many cases dangerous etc prohibition only makes them more dangerous, creates untold crime, gives inordinate amounts of power to organised crime syndicates, corrupts police forces and governments, destabilises entire countries and beyond this has failed abysmally etc, etc, etc.

 

We need to take on their whole convention and not simply focus on a single drug within their single convention. The days of arguing that cannabis is a soft harmless drug are over. These guys have been brilliant in ensuring that through dubious press releases, working with mutually minded organisations and shady research.

 

Take it to them where it really hurts and expose their inhumane and morally bankrupt system for what it is. Create an even bigger movement that stands by the ideals that while in a perfect society no one would use drugs.... however.

 

Look, just my thoughts and I'm sure they will be controversial with some here but I believe this is where it has to stand. Kick back and kick back hard.

[iamnotacop]

I think that we need to be arguing for the legalisation of all drugs on the basis that while they are in many cases dangerous etc prohibition only makes them more dangerous, creates untold crime, gives inordinate amounts of power to organised crime syndicates, corrupts police forces and governments, destabilises entire countries and beyond this has failed abysmally etc, etc, etc.

 

I agree wholeheartedly. I don't think that Med Use is the way to go, it is an angle, but not the be all and end all. The whole drug prohibition is what is wrong.

 

I do sympathise with people who need Cannabis for pain relief or whatever other med use, but personally I am for an end to all Drug Prohibition. Legalised med use is just a positive side effect of what I want.

 

So there for whenever I write letters or do whatever, I will be aiming for an end to the whole of prohibition. That way, when we say something they cant argue that that applies to harder drugs as well, and try to trap us into a corner. What works for one works for all. We need a complete overhaul of thinking, and a completely new way of looking at the problem.

 

Cannabis is only a small part of the bigger picture, IMO.

[littlbit]

Please note in the Treaty and in many areas this is repeated

 

Article 28

 

Control of cannabis

 

1. If a Party permits the cultivation of the cannabis plant for the production of cannabis or cannabis resin, it shall apply thereto the system of controls as provided in Article 23 respecting the control of the opium poppy.

 

2. This Convention shall not apply to the cultivation of the cannabis plant exclusively for industrial purposes (fibre and seed) or horticultural purposes.

 

3. The Parties shall adopt such measures as may be necessary to prevent the misuse of, and illicit traffic in, the leaves of the cannabis plant.

 

( (i) Require medical prescriptions for the supply or dispensation of drugs to individuals. This requirement need not apply to such drugs as individuals may lawfully obtain, use, dispense or administer in connexion with their duly authorized therapeutic functions; and

(ii) If the Parties deem these measures necessary or desirable, require that prescriptions for drugs in Schedule I should be written on official forms to be issued in the form of counterfoil books by the competent governmental authorities or by authorized professional associations.

 

In other words they are in breach of the Treaty.

[Indycar]

It would be the ultimate route iamnotacop. But the fact how fkd up some folks get due to meth 'n H, etc... I highly doubt it will ever happen. Only have to follow lasts week news and how their beating up on the legal stuff like alcohol 'n stilnox.

 

As i said, it would great to happen, but the bugga's (media,gov, do-gooders) have done a fantastic job of introducing hysterical paranoia amounst the mainstream of society. While illegal drugs are bought 'n sold, it's not gunna help our cause as well. So they'd be a certain few that wouldn't want reform.

 

[lightning]

The Preamble to the Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs, 1961 states, acknowledges and recognises that:

 

 

 

 

"the medical use of narcotic drugs continues to be indispensable for the relief of pain and suffering and that adequate provision "must" (emphasis added) be made to ensure the availability of narcotic drugs for such purposes."

 

 

 

So in not allowing/providing medical cannabis they are in breach of their obligations under the treaty.

Edited February 27, 2008 by lightning

[mullray]

It would be the ultimate route iamnotacop. But the fact how fkd up some folks get due to meth 'n H, etc... I highly doubt it will ever happen. Only have to follow lasts week news and how their beating up on the legal stuff like alcohol 'n stilnox.

 

As i said, it would great to happen, but the bugga's (media,gov, do-gooders) have done a fantastic job of introducing hysterical paranoia amounst the mainstream of society. While illegal drugs are bought 'n sold, it's not gunna help our cause as well. So they'd be a certain few that wouldn't want reform.

 

 

There's no doubt that all drug use comes with problems. Note tobacco related deaths against illicit drug deaths. Illicit drug deaths represent approximately 2% of all drug deaths which is minute compared to tobacco.

 

First off you need to accept that you can no longer sell the public on the idea that mj is different from the other drugs. Times have changed and the field we are playing on has changed due to widespread misinformation being circulated about cannabis. The movement needs to adapt and change to meet the new challenges that lie ahead - the question is how?

 

Just to address something: cool.gif (i) Require medical prescriptions for the supply or dispensation of drugs to individuals. This requirement need not apply to such drugs as individuals may lawfully obtain, use, dispense or administer in connexion with their duly authorized therapeutic functions; and

(ii) If the Parties deem these measures necessary or desirable, require that prescriptions for drugs in Schedule I should be written on official forms to be issued in the form of counterfoil books by the competent governmental authorities or by authorized professional associations.

 

All countries that signed the convention now cannot dispense heroin for medical purposes so this quote isn't in context. What it means is that opiates can still be prescribed and opiates can be grown under licence - as is the case in Tasmania. So now we in Australia cannot give the most effective painkiller (heroin) to cancer patients etc and instead fill them fulll of less pure, less effective opiates where their tolerance rapidly increases and eventually you end up with an emaciated person in palliative care being pumped full of substandard pain relief. The UK never signed the convention and there they still use heroin (its also why mj seeds are legal for display purposes which I know seems odd but thats the case) So, no, they're not in breach of their own convention, the drugs listed in the convention are illegal and banned and while they might allow derivatives the convention would not recognise that cannabis as a herbal, smokable product should be readily available to patients for meds. The WHO has done a lot of work to undermine the medicinal purposes of cannabis in order to discredit cannabis a a legitimate form of pain relief (medicine). Until it is medically proven (which would require the WHO to analyse the research and ammendments to be made to the convention) there is no legal standing to contest with in court.

 

Yes, I agree, Ice is a terrible drug and so are other drugs but what we have to look at is the failure of prohibition and how wrong it is on all levels. You also need to consider that they are now telling people that cannabis is the number one reason for mental health issues in the community. It may be a pack of lies but then how much of the rhetoric around the drug war isn't a pack of lies? It's time to say, all the issues we are dealing with in the mj movement relate to prohibition and that's where we need to begin. The argument that prohibition is flawed and has failed can never be undermined by the release of new research which all seems to have arisen in the last decade after the US Federal Government declared war on the med and cannabis legalisation movement.

 

My thoughts for what they're worth.

[blackheartedprofit]

I don't know old rocker, it's a tough sell all round given what has been happening and probably will remain happening for years to come. I think the med movement may in part be the cause of the problem. The bodies who want to see prohibition of all drugs remain in place see the mj movement as a direct threat because as it states in the World Drug Report:

 

No other drug has a movement that seeks to undermine the single narcotics convention as a whole. No other drug has been for intents and purposes legalised in some respects in some countries. No other drug undermines the convention more so than cannabis. (To this effect)

 

What the single narcotics convention states is just that. It is singular and all drugs are seen as the same within the convention. Cannabis has greatly undermined this convention and the UN WDR 2006 makes calls to unify and ratify the convention with special attention being paid to cannabis in this report. I believe what we are seeing now is a politically motivated and concerted attack on the legalisation movement with med cannabis being a key target. While the states in the US have been lenient on med cannabis the Federal Government has been ruthless in attacking the states for their med cannabis policies; so while it is pseudo legal you may also find yourself busted by federal US authorities.

 

 

In a sense what we are seeing now is the prohibition movement kicking back against the legalisation movement. Trace this latest series of events and you will find it stems mostly from the US Federal Government who targeted the Canadian scene through the INCB (a neutral UN body - yeah right) around 2000. Look at the action that has taken place since - it's formidable, ruthless and has been highly successful This stinks of the US and it also smells of collusion between them and global policing bodies.

 

Holland now has shifted their views. Icons of the Canadian scene have been arrested and the Canadian Government are becoming less and less tolerant, icons in the US scene have been arrested (Ed Rosenthal and Eddie Chong?) the UK has been attacked by UN bodies (The WHO and the INCB - 2 independent UN bodies - yeah right) and are about to repeal their downgrade on mj (very likely at a political level) and in general we've seen incredible amounts of busts globally - not just localised to Australia.

 

My bet is that the med movement is the last stand but it will fall within the next decade if current policy prevails. I don't like to be the prophet of doom but read the trends, watch the numbers and you can only come to one conclusion.

 

I think that we need to be arguing for the legalisation of all drugs on the basis that while they are in many cases dangerous etc prohibition only makes them more dangerous, creates untold crime, gives inordinate amounts of power to organised crime syndicates, corrupts police forces and governments, destabilises entire countries and beyond this has failed abysmally etc, etc, etc.

 

We need to take on their whole convention and not simply focus on a single drug within their single convention. The days of arguing that cannabis is a soft harmless drug are over. These guys have been brilliant in ensuring that through dubious press releases, working with mutually minded organisations and shady research.

 

Take it to them where it really hurts and expose their inhumane and morally bankrupt system for what it is. Create an even bigger movement that stands by the ideals that while in a perfect society no one would use drugs.... however.

 

Look, just my thoughts and I'm sure they will be controversial with some here but I believe this is where it has to stand. Kick back and kick back hard.

 

you're right on the money imo, mullray, the only answer is legalisation of all drugs, because the reality is that people are going to take drugs, legal or illegal, the facts speak for themselves, i wonder sometimes who mainstream society thinks reap the benefits from the "illegal" drug trade, it certainly isn't the end user or the street dealer, they are the sacrificial lambs of those that do reap the actual benefits, who are one and the same as those who enforce the laws, it's a wonderfull setup for them, offer the odd "druggie" up for a bust here and there to make the appearance of doing something about it, keep the sheeple happy and scared, as some have mentioned this is a global problem and not isolated to cannabis, also it is not limited to drugs, it involves freedom of the individual in general, so, whilst the majority of society is living beyond their means in the west and consuming the planet with no regard or thought to where all their toys are actually coming from and who is being royally fucked over to get them, they will have their toys and live their lives in total ignorance of the realities, this is what world governments and media and vested financial interests seem to do so well, the last thing any government wants is a society that thinks, if anyone decided to look at this problem taking in the whole view they would easily see the quasi religious undertones that run through societies, governments and media all over the planet is the glue that holds all this bullshit together, i have no problem with freedom of religion bgut in allowing that i demand my right to freedom from religion as well, religious beliefs have been used since time immemorial as stand over tactics and literally a big stick (in certain phases of history) to dominate and conform the individual to be part of the herd, those that choose not to join are held up as evil, scum of the earth, devil incarnate, on and on , ad infinitum,the shackles must be broken for any progress to be made and the simple answer is education of facts, as they are, not tampered with adjusted, twisted and every other form of censorship, sadly i doubt we will see any improvement in our lifetimes, we as a species are too far gone imo