Cellobind

[DoctorWho]

Oxidation and preservation are bullshit excuses to use cellobind.  No matter what you're going to lose some plant matter every time the buds touch something but if you look closely the amount of trichs you lose is minimal.  99% of shake is leaf and the hairs that come out of the buds which are no real loss what so ever considering the make the remaining buds weight for weight slightly more potent then they were before and not only that but as shake tastes like shit in most cases removing that from your buds makes them better tasting too.  If oxygen is an issue you just need to use smaller jars for curing or pack the buds in a bit more because an equal volume of air will be displaced and with less air available comes less oxygen. 

 

Anyone who considers themself beyond a weed snob enough to use cellobind for preservation must know deep down that this product isn't a part of their plant and will change the way it smells, tastes and cures like in the long term.  Normal growers will never use it so at the end of the day this is solely aimed at commercial growers who only care about money.  There's just no way of getting around that and I'd bet that within a few years virtually all commercial bud in Australia will be treat with both PGRs and cellobind because of how effective it is.  The almighty dollar rules businesses so hydro shops will stock it as long as it sells and complaining to politicians will do no good because they'll think it's great that people are consuming 30% less for the same price.  Just thinking about whats coming makes me mad as hell but glad I grow my own.  We really should show everyone we can this thread or information about the product to try and get them to start growing their own.  Only when some of the profits get taken out of the market because of this shit will they try to compete using quality instead of quantity.

[Naycha]

, protein…you are baaad man. Love your honesty on a public forum, 
Im not judging you but is your gear reeeeally just for personal??

 



I certainly understand the concern voiced by the best of you 
but Im not so sure its all just a marketing gimmick - the reasoning holds its 
ground IMO. The medical marijuana industry pushes the oxidation issue all the 
time, N-sublimation storage and so on. I don't think they would do this if there 
wasn't good cause. I admit Ive never noticed my gear degrade and I store in
 containers but then again Ive not measured it against anything so the experience 
is purely subjective.



From everything Ive read in scientific literature THC 
profiles taper off from the point of harvest so whats left after a 6months
 would be substantially less, irrespective if your getting stoned, unless you have a 
freakin lab to measure blood samples for half-time rates the effect of the drug
 will only muddy your attempts to determine precisely how stoned you are from 
last time and the time before that etc..

 



I think about the tobacco industry and the amount of synthetic 
preservatives they use in cigarettes that are converted into carcinogens like 
toluene, benzene or hydrogen cyanide. Its crazy to think even though I quit
 smoking years ago I still mull up with it.

 



So in all fairness I say thumbs up to the company for 
choosing to use a benign fibre thats from the marijuana plant itself. If what 
people are saying is true and its reducing the smell somewhat, then I think thats 
indicative the product does what it claims to and is stopping the oxidation in 
its tracks.

 



However the big here question is is there simply a way 
around it just by using some common sense storage practices? I would think a 
freezer is obvious. Otherwise I suppose its a trade off between having potent 
bud that quickly degrade's vs retaining as much of the original potency as 
possible with a preservative and probably paying stupid amounts of money for it. 
Maybe with elite lines like og raskals whitefire and cousins it could be good to 
have some protective layer on the trillions of crystals on that strain, but as 
far as I know the genetics aren't in Australia yet ..and if they are they are they are 
sure to be keeping quiet about it.   

 

I still argue that whatever degradation of cannabinoids may happen it is not significant enough to noticeably lower the quality of well stored Cannabis.

 

The 'MMJ Industry' pushing products etc holds no ground for me either, nor does the idea that having a large amount of trichomes requires protection. Trichomes are covered by a waxy layer that does a great job of protecting the cannabinoids from oxidation courtesy of nature.

 

Premium quality Cannabis for personal use has no need for sprays, soaks, and other assorted gimmicks. If you expect to be storing buds for extended periods of time a vacuum sealer is a much better and smarter investment. Place the buds in a crushproof container and place it under vacuum. Don't lower the quality of your harvest with this crap, spend a bit of time learning good storage methods.

 

Naycha

[protein]

 Who gives a shit about weight increase when the yield is exactly the same , nobody unless you are into selling and feel comfortable conning/ ripping people off . 

I feel as if ive been misunderstood so let me make my 
intentions clear. iv used these samples because im experimenting with trying to 
preserve my weed and as its for my own use only and i am trying to reduce the huge
weight increase if i can without overdiluting it. hence im happy to discuss 
what iv done and what the results have been. i could have chosen to say nothing 
but im really interested by this topic as my buds do change over time from 
buzzy high to a mega couch lock, and I much prefer the former.. and if this 
isn’t deterioration to cbn then please someone explain what it is. if you sell
 weed and use a preservative then why not just reduce the price accordingly if 
you want to take the high road – excuse the pun J


 

-protein

[louise]

 

 

trying to 
preserve my weed

 

Stick it in a glass jar with a well sealing lid and keep int in a dark cupboard... I doubt your weed is going to last longer than 5 or 6 years, and for that amount of time a glass jar in a dark cupboard is perfect.

[peterdpiper]

This is an experiment Iv done
with cellobind. These two buds have been sitting in the open air in a bowl on my coffee
table for 4 weeks, to see what happens oxidation-wise…One has cellobind and the other
is a control. Both are off the same plant.

Can you tell the difference?...
The one on the right has been treated and is about 35% heavier. It feels like a
denser strain to the touch. It also has kept its green colour where as the
untreated one has started yellowing off.

There’s also a smell
difference. At first the untreated bud had stronger aroma. Now I have to give
them both a slight squeeze to get the pong. They both still smell great, but
now after 4wks the cellobind bud has a  stronger ‘punch’ when I squeeze it.

Other than these subtleties there’s
really no discernable difference. Taste-wise its indistinguishable from the
background cellulose fibre smoke of the pot.


Conclusion; I’m genuinely
surprised the cellobind bud appears superior to the untreated bud after a month!! ..That
said I cannot tell if its any stronger at this stage both seem the same – so
lets give it another month and see! If it is preserving potency, for all the
bad press it been given about the weight gain, then its spot on the money and
seems the real deal.
 

[Sir PsychoHashy]

Can't believe this thread is still going so vigorously.  It's so obvious that this stuff is aimed at, and only really useful for, commercial purposes, but if anyone wants to use it for personal good luck and I hope it works out well.

 

Bit of a thought on Peterdpipers post.  It occurs to me that one of the advantages of curing is the degradiation of the chlorophyl, and looking at the above pic it would appear that this is not really happening as well in the treated bud.  Would that not be a disadvantage?  I could be wrong about this though.

 

I was talking to the missus recently about the changes to commercially grown weed in Oz since the 80s, in particular the way that "hydro" initially became the product to look for, and how it has changed since it first hit the scene.  Used to be it was generally more potent and better overall quality than the bulk of the bush getting around, but now it seems to be mostly crap tasting, weaker potency, poor quality gear.  To the point that even some of my kids 20 year old mates are no longer saying "nothing but hyg for me, bush is crap". 

 

End result of our discussion was that unless a large scale commercial outfit decides to try to corner market share by dropping the PGRs, growing to maturity, drying properly, and not contaminating the buds, that the current trend will continue as money is their motivation and they couldn't give a shit about their end users.

 

At least stuff like this is a huge improvement from a health and taste perspective over stuff like fly spray that is currently being used to add weight etc, so it's not all bad I suppose.

 

In the meantime, I'll continue with my $2 jars from the reject shop kept in  a dark cool spot.  Would also have to agree with Naychas comments, as long as the trich's are not damaged (crushproof containers) they self protect to a fair degree from oxidisation etc

[DoctorWho]

End result of our discussion was that unless a large scale commercial outfit decides to try to corner market share by dropping the PGRs, growing to maturity, drying properly, and not contaminating the buds, that the current trend will continue as money is their motivation and they couldn't give a shit about their end users.

I spoke to my hydro shop guy about cellobind and he said that he turned a 1L bottle of cellobind ($120) into a pound of bud as it made his harvest go from 4lb to 5lb.  Cellobind is cheap enough for all commercial growers to buy in massive amounts and with gains like that to be made it will never leave the market.  It might replace PGRs as the weight gains could be higher and drying using both a PGR and cellobind too risky to do which would drastically increase the quality of the buds hitting the market.  That would be a great thing for buyers but short of getting the product banned its going to become standard practice to use it.