Greens Party Policies

[Tom]

Firstly, as I have said before, the Greens do not advocate the use of drugs, what they are saying is that drug control at the user level should not be dealt with by the law as it is a health issue, the policy on mj allows for people to cultivate their own personal supply. All this information is at the Greens website, they also seem to be the only political party that puts their policies on their site.

 

The greens support the freaking junkies that break into my house for their next fix

If the Green party policy on drug reform was enacted the junkies wouldn't need to break into homes and businesses as they would not have to pay the black market prices any more, if you have ever bought mj from a dealer then you have done more to encourage crime than the Greens have.

 

http://www.gamers-forums.com/smilies/contrib/ruinkai/coolgleamA.gif http://64.207.13.28/mysmilies/otn/glasses/smokin.gif

[FreddieMoonlight]

It may or may not be true that all politicians are the same - but registering to vote and voting is the only real way to have your say in a country such as ours.I don`t care how many protests you attend, if you don`t vote I believe your right to complain about government policies is forfeited.

On the matter of Junkies, I think Bageera IS being compassionate.IMO, they are taking up way too much oxygen.Illness , my arse!...They are self indulgent losers on a grand scale.

Sorry if this offends.It is only my opinion.

[Luke Skywalker]

Okay, let's see now....

 

decreade , Apr 5 2003, 11:24 AM

...dunno how long federal labor has got left.....finances are fucked, infighting factions galore, a leader with about as much charisma as kerry chikarovski - they have strayed far from their working class ethic and now seem to spend their time chasing the popular vote....

 

Indeed, I must agree with you there, but uless I am mistaken, I was referring to the best chances for federal level drug reform.... in the next 10 yrs or so. As to the party itself, well, the two major parties always go through these infightings and self-destructive impulses. This is a result of the nature of Federal politics. However, when the Major parties become gripped by a strong, and forceful leadership, then almost nothing can stop political will. Look at little Johnny. I may not agree with him, but I have to admit he's got a very strong political will. He wants it, and that's what we need to enact Federal Drug reform to occur in the next 10 yrs. 1, A very strong labor leadership with a sympathy to drug reform, and 2, A substantial vote to the greens and a Greens held balance-of-power.

 

The second seems more likely than the first, but then again, politics is a funny old thing, and sometimes a lazarus can come back. (Remember where Johnny was?)

 

Right, next, Bageera. Dealers of heroin. Now, do you think that for a second, bringing in the death penalty will make anything better? How will making the price of heroin on the streets more expensive, (which is what you are essentially proposing, to eliminate supply, right?) help stop people from breaking into your house? If anything, the people in society who have succumbed to the basal pleasure responses of their brain will be forced to steal more, break in more often and even get more violent because instead of costing $100 to score, now it costs $200. And so the cycle continues, ad nauseum.

 

But the thing is, you just don't seem to understand one thing, Bageera. There will always be a supply of heroin on the streets, no matter what the cost is, because there will always be a demand. So punishing those who supply it is a futile effort, because of human nature. We will take a risk if we think the pay off is good enough. With heroin as a law enforcement problem and not a health and education problem, the pay off is big. So someone will always take the risk. What the Greens are proposing is to take supply of these illicit drugs out of the hands of the dealers, who quite frankly, aren't really concerned with the well being of the users, and put it into the hands of the government. This way, if someone does become addicted, they don't get addicted to something of varying quality and purity, they don't have problems with massive overdose because the supply is regular and pure, and then the health system can work at getting these people, (yes, they are people.) off heroin, and back into a productive life.

 

Humans generally respond far better to a hug than a slap, don't you think? Shouldn't a human, medical problem have a humane, medicinal cure? We're not going to eradicate drugs, the last 50 years of the "War on Drugs" proved that. The Greens aren't encouraging drug use either, they want to take a realistic approach to drug use in society. People are doing it anyway. They may as well do it safely, and with the knowledge that society will protect them.

 

And let me ask you this, have you ever used heroin? Do you even know what it feels like, let alone the difficulty of the "strongest" person to resist that temptation, once tasted? I've seen every single type of person you could imagine addicted to heroin. It does not discriminate. Anyone can end up in a situation where they have a first taste. Don't kid yourself by thinking you're "strong" enough that you would resist in the same situations. It can, has, and will happen to anyone. So we may as well deal with it, and try to help those who can't control their impulses. What's the alternative? Let people die because they aren't as "strong" as you? Once again, this smacks of a bit of third reich to me.

 

Oh, and as for freddie moonlight, well, I don't agree that your right to complain about government policies is forfeited, but it certainly would make you look a right wally if you didn't vote and then bitched that you didn't like the government. To all those who would say that one vote doesn't count, and that there will always be either a lib or labor government, remember, the wheels of politics turn in strange ways. The two major political parties are starting to strain a bit in holding the hearts of the populace. It takes these parties a whole pile of "one votes" to make up their power base. If enough people make their voices heard, then the governments, and major parties, will change. Apathy is not an excuse, just a cop out. The future of this country is in the hands of every individual voter in the nation. Not the Labor and Liberal party. If you don't like what they do, tell them. And find out if anyone else offers a better plan. Then vote according to your concience. Not, I repeat, not according to how the rest of the country votes. Really think about where you cast your vote. It's a rare thing to even have the right to vote freely in this world, exercise it with caution and forethought. you only get one every few years....

 

I respect your opinions, but damn, compassion for humanity doesn't run deep within the bones of Freddie and Bageera, does it?

 

Vote GREEN for change!

 

(Damn, long posting again, gotta stop smoking honey oil before posting..... :: )

[decreade]

couldnt agree with you more mr skywalker; cant stop bemoaning the state of labor - stems from a long and dissapointing relationship with the party .....Must say that i hope the greens keep stepping up and filling the void that labor has left - the democrats gave me the belief that there could be more than two parties contesting the leadership but they fucked it spectacularly.......i could definately get used to bob brown as prime minister / prez?

[Guest Field_of_Light]

Well put Luke Skywalker.........

[Cronic_la_jar_jar]

In the word of you Luke skywalker the only way the greens are going to have a major affect is by forming with labor party "WAKE UP CALL” whether you like me or not it doesn’t matter. AUSTRALIAN POLITICS HAS NO TOLERANCE TO DRUGS. I don’t know if you remember reading that anywhere but that’s the said truth my friend and while they have a legalization policy they will never be taken Seri sly by any government or be given preferences by one in any federal election as I have said many times majority of the population is against all forms of drugs like it or not once again it’s the sad truth including cannabis. Now I don’t know if your brilliant political minds figured this one out already but how do you intend to get preferences in a political arena that has no Tolerance hmm .Epically with a party like the greens witch has no real presence and is laughed at by most.

 

The greens do want to help herrion junkies and you know it don’t say the programs work because they don’t, how about you look around and smell reality for a while how about you actually take the time to go to these so called needle exchange places and see what’s goes on with these people . they need rehab centers not needle exchange programs any moron with a Uni Degree should know that and look what these places are actually doing to Community's like Redfern & King cross, Cabramatta if you say its improved your a liar nothings gotten better I see needles all the time walking around Fairfield , cabramatta & lanes Vale what about the children that see it are you going to make excuses in front of them to because id love to get a member of the green government to explain to kids why needles are their in the first place , are you going to lie again to make yourself look like saviors when passing crap like this is destroying communities not saving them .You can deny this all you want .The times when vans come around Herron dealers actually go to these needle exchange van's and get new needles & stuff to sell in a kit the van's don’t take back the old needles witch is their job isn’t it . As for making other drugs tolerable as much as I am for the legalizing of weed I am not for any other legalization including . Acid, Speed, Herron or coke.

 

They should remain illegal and if you actually used both sides of your brains you will see my point. fair enough making it legal will take down its street value what about the people that take it and destroy their family lives don’t say it doesn’t happen just walking down red fern today I saw a aboriginal family with 3 kids no older then 10 saying I want to go home while their parents and grandparent by the looks of him were smashed of their face not drunk, smashed while the mother was walking around red fern station asking for cigarettes? what about young kids not even 16 or 17 that life’s are destroyed because of Herron (REHAB CENTERS NO EXCHANGE PROGRAMS) .Now if you say that’s better your a liar and cheat and further more your lying to your self the green party will not make that better by making these facilities available their only destroying these neibourhoods more instead of helping them to build. The greens claim they care about the community how about you stop lying to yourselves and do something witch is actually going to help communities instead of thinking about policy's witch will benefit your own miserable existences. And as for grass roots ha. You have one green representatives witch is for the legalization of weed but is against Refugees but one witch is not for the legalization of weed but for refuges now according to tom. mp’s join the green party for a range of issues but what’s the point of voting for party witch has one amendment you would vote for but has 1000 other policy’s that you don’t agree with now sorry if that sounds stupid but maybe you ‘GREENIES” could clarify that for me and tell me what would be the point in helping a party like that.

 

wouldt it just be better if we got people off hard drugs , instead of helping them kick thier habbit . We all know here weed is the true enlightment

Edited April 5, 2003 by Cronic_la_jar_jar

[Luke Skywalker]

Does anyone else want to try and enlighten this guy? I'm sick of trying to get him to open his eyes. Please....

[Cronic_la_jar_jar]

In what way have you tryed to do that luke . everything you have said to me just dictates the policy's you belive in ? . yet again you refuse to directly answer the questions i ask by passing on the buck . Is it not better to get people of hard drugs then help them kick thier habbit ? Edited April 5, 2003 by Cronic_la_jar_jar

[Luke Skywalker]

How does restricting supply get people off drugs? Have you seen a miraculous reduction in the amount of people using "illicit" drugs in the last 50 years of the "War on Drugs"? No. These people are using drugs, and have been for the entire time of prohibition. The amount of users is not dictated by the supply of a drug, it's the other way around. The demand for drugs will always be there, be it for Alcohol, Tobacco, Heroin, Cannabis, Speed, MDMA, and a myriad of others, so imprisoning people because they lose control of their habits and because there are others willing to supply what the government wants to ignore, is ridiculous. These people are acting in the ways they are, not because they use drugs, but because the supply of those drugs is irregular and black market. The laws enacted on the pushing of the U.S. government through the u.n. were based on outrageous science, and have since caused 10 times more human misery than the drugs themselves could ever have.

 

And as to why the needle exchange programes and other harm-minimisation techniques haven't worked in the way you seem to expect them to, is because the nation doesn't have a uniform drug policy. The states are individually responsible for drug laws, but the federal government has a say in importation, and they control the purse strings too. The point is, that if you have a state government attempting to change the current "war on drugs" mentality, and then the federal government won't play along, the attempt is doomed to failure. Not because the ideas or policies of drug reform themselves are to blame, but because they are being sabotaged by the existence of contradictory approaches of governments. In other words, unless the states and federal government get together, have a national summit with binding resolutions and uniform drug legistlation nation-wide, then we won't get anywhere. We, as Australian people, have to demand that the punitive measures used for the last 50 years, which have not only failed to "eradicate" drugs, but have taken their use and profitability to all time records, be abolished, and the state and federal governments must stand together in recognising the underlying causes and reasons for not only drug abuse, but drug use within society.

 

Cronic, if you can't understand that "illicit" drugs are no worse or better than the "licit" ones, then go back to basic chemistry. The effects of alcohol and heroin are very similar, and they affect the same receptors in the brain. So why should someone who uses a needle or bong to stimulate their brain receptors be ostracised, whilst the other person who drinks liquids to do the same job, is called a "true aussie...." That's bullshit. People should have the right to choose the drugs which they want to use. The people already are using drugs, and will continue to do so. Just because they want to have a pill or a shot instead of a middy or tinnie is their choice, and they should be able to choose knowing that the drugs they want to use will be manufactured to regualted quality, with safety guidelines and dosage instructions. There needs to be a massive education campaign about the safe use of drugs, whatever the type. Trying to pretend that it doesn't exist is only going to end up killing people, let alone being stupid.

 

I think that maybe you should look at what can be done in a society which changes its basic policies on drug use and abuse within society. Look at the Netherlands. Hard drug use has actually dropped since they introduced their drug reforms. The city isn't falling to pieces, the crime rate has dropped and the people are happy. Why should we put a person in jail because they don't like to get high on alcohol, but prefer speed? It's pretty stupid.

 

You have one green representatives witch is for the legalization of weed but is against Refugees but one witch is not for the legalization of weed but for refuges now according to tom."

 

Show me.

 

Look, if you don't agree with the policies of the greens en masse, I'm not telling you to vote for them, but are you doing anything to encourage the party which has got a majority of policies you agree with, to legalise cannabis growing, consumption and sale? Or are you one of those who prefers the current state of affairs, because it ensures a large profit for you? The stuff shouldn't be worth this much, for fucks sake it grows on trees. Think about that, and then tell me why it costs so much, and what you propose we do about it.

 

Chronic, of course the greens want to help heroin addicts, don't you? What would you propose we do? You really don't live in the real world, do you? Have you ever used heroin? Do you have anyone close to you who has used, or even overdosed? I don't think you have. Maybe you should talk to some "junkies" as you refer to them. (You could be called a junkie too....) Maybe if you walked a single day in the real world you may have a clue. I suspect you have led a somewhat sheltered life, and this is reflected in your harsh attitude to your fellow man. And it's so supremely ironic, because the policy your arguing against would remove you from the criminal world, legitimise what you like to use and make your life easier. That's pretty twisted.

 

I may not agree with your opinions, but I will fight to the death for your right to voice them. I have a feeling that the sentiment is not mutual, or am I wrong here?

[white_cluster]

the amount of users is directly related to the supply, there is proof of this in the 1984 cannabis droughts where heroin use nearly doubled.

So maybe if pot was legal and heroin had even less tolerance the opposite could happen, there would certainly be less new junkies.