Seedlings just collapsing overnight

[Darwinbuds]

I already posted this in the introduction forum (Im a new member) but have now found the appropriate place for my question...

 

I have obtained seed of White Rhino, White Widow, Super Slver Haze and Durban Poison, the seedlings have germinated well and come up strong but when they have about 2-3 sets of leaves they just seem to collapse quite literally overnight...

 

I have noticed on a couple that there was a tiny dark thing moving inside the stem which I am assuming is a grub, and also noticed some kind of small fly thing hanging around. The seeldings were in good quality sterile potting soil, in tubes and taken outdoors during the day and brought back in at night. I had 12 seedlings at one point, now just down to one DP...

 

Does anyone know what could be causing this and what I have to do to stop this happening to my next batch of seedlings???

 

BTW I live in Darwin and it is quite wet and humid right now, I dont know if that has anythign to do with it but I dont think I can wait until the dry season before starting plants. Buds are very expensive here in Darwin right now ($380-$420/Oz for basic weed) so really want to be able to grow my own and grow them as naturally as I can, so toxic bug sprays are the last resort...

 

Well thanks and I hope someone here can help my growing dilemma.

 

~S

[biggerbuds]

hello mate, if i was you i would never put an inside plant outside,you bring all sorts of pests back into your house doing that

 

been there done that.

 

oh and go easy on the watering seedlings,only water when tube feels lighter and dryer,use perlite in the mix and do not give seedlings any food for 2-3 weeks

Edited February 16, 2009 by biggerbuds

[Darwinbuds]

Thanks mate

 

The plants are destined for outdoors, I was only bringing them in overnight to protect them from rain and possums, then back out into the sun the next morning. I did consider going indoors using aeroponics but wanted to try a natural 'healthier' way of growing bud...maybe naieve but I would feel like Im depriving the plants of their right to sun and fresh air...

 

I considered that the mix might have been staying to wet and causing fungal probs, but I definately have seen some kind of grub moving inside the stem of one of the dead plants. I also found some tiny snails (I assume they are a native snail not the normal garden one you get down south) the size of a grain of rice on the soil of one of the seedlings that died. I didnt find them on any of the other plants.

 

Maybe I have a combination of pest and fungal probs...does anyone have a natural remedy that doesnt involve poisonous sprays etc?

 

Thanks

 

~S

[Cyclops]

Sounds very much like scarab fly to me, you will have to use an insecticide to get rid of it. Humidity could be a big part of the problem.

 

And I can't let this go without a comment >>>oh and go easy on the watering seedlings,only water when tube feels lighter and dryer,use perlite in the mix and do not give seedlings any food for 2-3 weeks<<<

 

That applies to clones before they get roots ..... for seedlings thats a load of rubbish and will seriously hurt them.

 

In your situation I would be using grow wool ... moving them outside for a few hours each day isn't going to cause any problems, so long as you keep the light cycle right.

[nitram]

Hi Darwinbuds,

 

Darwinbuds...........Basically what happens is that it seems that some kind of bug/grub seems to get inside the stem and eat it from the inside out. The plant looks healthy one day and the next morning has collapsed and what looks like a small grub thing is moving inside it, or else a small fly is hanging around. Its driving me out of my mind and I dont know what to do to get the seedlings to the stage where they have a woody stem and more than 6 leaves... I never had this problem when growing 10 years or more ago, only recent attempts have gone this way.

 

I should also mention that it is very hot, wet and humid here in Darwin right now so I dont know if that is a factor either. Is there any one on here from the tropics who has experience in growing outdoors? What are the best varieties to grow? Best techniques and time of the year???

 

Basically what happens is that it seems that some kind of bug/grub seems to get inside the stem and eat it from the inside out. The plant looks healthy one day and the next morning has collapsed and what looks like a small grub thing is moving inside it, or else a small fly is hanging around.

 

1) Hard to say without a picture & moree information.

 

so ow i interpret this line.- "Basically what happens is that it seems that some kind of bug/grub seems to get inside the stemand eat it from the inside out. The plant looks healthy one day and the next morning has collapsed and what looks like a small grub thing is moving inside it, or else a small fly is hanging around.

 

so this happens shorty after germination (cracking of the seed shell) & taproot extends. To what age do the 'littens' normally live to - any schreated (jagged) leaves form ? @ approx 2 weeks or 3-4 weeks the bottom 'cotylrdon's (small tiny oval shaped leaves that make the non-jagged very fist leaves). do you get that far?

 

The flys could be fungas nats and the lava eat the roots or possibly be 'sacred fly' or 'scarab fly' (small black fly similar to a fruit fly) that is insect pest which lays eggs either in the compost or soil & the lava (grubs) form that are internal as you say 'inside the germinated stem'.

 

I am no pest expert as I tend to avoid them like the plage.

 

As for a way out try to throw a 'screen' over them till they are big enough. Suggestions a "cake fly keeper off a thingy"

 

all the beast Darwinbuds

 

Nitty.

[Darwinbuds]

Thanks BB and Cyc for your ideas.

 

Cyclops I googled scarab fly but only got results for scarab beetles, which definately arent the problem... Do you have anymore info on this and what sprays would you recommend??

 

As for humidity unfortunately I cant do much about that in Darwin this time of the year, I could wait until the dry season but thats still a couple of months away, so I cant wait... I need some beautiful ladies to give me good head NOW!!!

 

~S

[Darwinbuds]

Nitram the babies were about 2-3 weeks old and had formed a couple of sets of true leaves, jagged as you call them. The stems were thinnner than a matchstick and still green and soft. I didnt get a pic of the grub, it was hardly visible to the naked eye and for a minute I thought I was seeing things when I saw the dark spot moving inside the stem. IF they appear again I will try to get a pic but being so small might not show much detail.

 

IS the pic of the fungus gnats or the scarab fly??? The description you gave seems to match what I see but I dont think I have seen the ones in the pics at all. Ill ask at the nursery for an appropriate spray.

 

Thanks heaps for your help fellas!!! It is much appreciated!!!

 

~S

[Darwinbuds]

Have done some research and Im pretty sure that the scarab fly could be the culprit! Some good advice here and also some info from the internet saying that they thrive in moist soil, and since it has been so wet here it has been impossible to keep the soil on the drier side... What I read suggests only watering the seedlings when the soil appears dry, that way the grubs cant mature or hatch from their eggs.

 

SO Ill give that a go and also have a crack at the "cake fly keeper off a thingy" solution...

 

Great forum guys I wish I had known about this 4 weeks ago...

[biggerbuds]

Cyclops mate if you new the first thing about growing, you would no full well you do not start feeding seedlng strait away

 

1 because seedlings have anuff food in there shell to last up to 3 weeks after they pop

 

2 giving food to soon will make the whole plant soft and make it 100% easyer for the bugs to attack it

 

so get your facts right before you ever try and correct me,

 

its the other way around you can feed clones before you can feed seedlings

 

what a fool you really are

[TheTreeBoundRat]

I get the same problem here in North Queensland inside or out and found by far the biggest culprits are a couple of diferent species of small ants. They bite and weaken the stem and or leaves, sometimes getting to the seedling before its even burst the soil. My main defense is taping flyscreen around the top of the seedling tray. Nine times out of ten this works but a particular species of ants that are really fuken small still make their way in and have a go. Any way have a look and see if you can see any crawling around. Its a pity you lost good seed. It might be better to practice with some bag seed until you get it down pat also. Good luck mate.

 

 

Biggerbuds Im not sure what your on but you really need to lighten the fuck up and get your facts right ya dick brain!. I always get better results when adding a light nutrient to my seedling medium from the start so I dunno what you on about there. Not feeding for 2-3 weeks is great if if you want weedy malnourished seedling