do we represent cannabis?

[raverspec]

Get the reply sent to Brash's mailbox (I'm sure he'll let you) He can post it here

[mull]

Quote of Frazzle's - "So thats where i stop, what i beleive we need is a cleanskinned spokesperson who is beyond reproach to spearhead a fight for law reform if we are to make any headway."

 

 

I agree mate

Sure all the users and abusers of cannabis can stand up for law reform, but it won't be an effective stand.

 

Effective stand for cannabis prohibition repeal, would come from 'publically well respected' citizens/ celebrities whom don't use cannabis, yet advocate it's use. Not only as medication, but as a far safer recreational substitute to the commonly accepted legal drugs.

These people couldn't be taken down or dismissed by public opinion. However they do have their reputations to lose, and, nothing to gain from doing this for us.

 

It would be like if alcohol was still prohibited and all the alcoholics stood up for reform! No-one in sobriety would care. There is seemingly no cause for them to care about.

Same goes for all non users of cannabis.

 

It's hard to make the comparsion between commercial growers and personal too, but it has to be said. We all work with the prohibited plant. Possible only personal growers will continue to do so, after it becomes legal, may be the only difference.

 

As for selling, sharing, giving away cannabis, well we know that's trafficking now. But if not prohibited, trafficking is exactly the same as giving away veggies from the backyard! Or fruit off the trees! Or swapping and or exchanging cash for anything you produce. My my, could even pay tax like any crop farmer (might)

 

The term drug dealer is such a propagandic smeer too. Implying of course that a person who grows a prohibited plant has a nasty name attached in the hope of control. Doctors are drug dealers, so are chemists. They also prescribe the wrong doses from time to time! Can't do that with cannabis. Many prescritption drugs have detrimental side efects and overdose/ dependance possibilities. All drugs come with a good profit margin too no doubt.

 

End rant.. hahah oops..

[Luke Skywalker]

But you still haven't seemed to grasp the basic contradiction of urging people to stand up and be counted from behind a fake screen name.

 

The internet isn't real life, (well, maybe for you....) and what I do in my real life is far more than what I've seen many do on the internet. Simply because I don't associate "Luke Skywalker" with my other activities doesn't make the point any less valid.

 

I'm not going to identify myself to you or anyone else as being Luke Skywalker. I will identify my REAL self in public and hold my views very strongly, but I'm not going to name myself IN THIS FORUM, because it wouldn't acheive anything, and would likely be more detrimental to the cause than helpful. Ozstoners is a growing community, and I'm not going to endanger it that way.

 

I do see your point, but what the heck does anything I've proposed doing have to do with identifying myself as Luke Skywalker? I'm writing letters as my real person, not as an internet character. I'm talking to people as a real person, not as an internet character, and I'm voting as a real person, not as an internet character. Have you done any of those things? To be honest, I doubt you've done a single solitary thing to actually help the cause of repealing prohibition in this country. Please prove me wrong.... I know you have a brain, which could be put to good use... But saying it's impossible to change the law makes it so, don't you think?

 

Once again, if you find fault with the idea that we should stand up and be counted as private citizens, (not as internet personas) please let me know what there is wrong with this. Do you want it to remain illegal? Perhaps you do....

 

Attack the idea, if you really disagree with it. Not the person proposing it.

 

Yeah, cleanskins would help, absolutely, but I don't think they're necessary. The prohibition of alcohol in the united states wasn't repealed because those who don't drink demanded the right for others to do so without being considered criminal. It was repealed because there was a vast population of drinkers, and the vast majority of those did so responsibly. There was no truth to the argument that imposing a blanket ban on alcohol reduced use, and this was finally realised by the governments of the day, thanks to average joes getting out there and talking. And drinking. Well, we're already smoking, so all we need now are the average joes, (which is us by the way) to start talking and arguing the case.

 

But what's the main difference between those who fought against prohibition of alcohol and those who claim to fight prohibition of weed?

 

Effort.

 

The majority of users of cannabis are not the equivalents of alcoholics. They're recreational drug users, like the guy who buys a beer or 6 each weekend.

 

If you're too scared to write under your own name, do it in someone elses. Is it that hard to find someone with no connection to weed to give you their name? (Or just take it?) Alternatively, don't just ignore the letter that comes back asking for your name and address, send another email and then tell them you're not interested in being arrested for your political views and actions and ask why you won't get a reply until you do give a name and address. They are your servants, not the other way around. Perhaps send a physical letter, (being careful with prints if you've already been busted for something and feel that paranoid) and don't give an address but ask for any reply to come via the web. Explain yourself, and you might get somewhere.

 

Write to newspapers, who are obliged to keep your address and even name withheld and secret, if you so request, under journalistic codes of conduct which they take very, very seriously. A national or state newspaper lives and breathes this stuff. Give someone elses legitimate name and address who has little or nothing to do with you, if you are a grower. If you're just a smoker, then you have little to lose, (what, a fine of a few hundred bucks for having an implement, and that's if anything happens for writing a letter to a paper, which it won't....) and everything (your rights) to gain.

 

I do understand why people aren't too keen to stick their necks out and potentially be the first to be chopped off, I feel the same way myself, but we have to. Nothing will change otherwise. I'm not going to risk OSA by identifying myself because I hold strong political views about this, but I'll certainly risk my own freedom for it, and I do so regularly in my actions.

 

Who of you would be willing to march on our respective parliaments on a set date for law reform?

[Frazz]

OK Luke you speak like you know it all, but i do resent the innuendoes you direct at me, as i would like for you to walk a mile in my shoes.

[pipeman]

yeah before criticising a man you should walk a mile in his shoes.

 

that way he won't hear what you said, and you'll have his shoes.

[everest]

If everyone on this site was interviewed as representatives of the stoner community, what impression would we give?

 

i'd hope as stoners we would give off the impression of honesty , hardworking and down to earth ... salt of the earth people , to be honest i don't know any fuck wit stoners .... just good souls .

 

 

Would getting to know the people behind the screen names encourage an argument for law reform or would it only confirm that marijuana destroys lives and stoners are a waste of space.

 

 

no, stoners are well trained in annomimity for obvious reasons .I think the average jo blow stoner wouldn't even worry about law reform at all , they are over that shit . i also think that mj does not wreck lives at all .... all sorts of things wreck lives .

 

If you don't think your life is a positive example for cannabis law reform then maybe you should do something about it. For yourself if nothing else. If your life isn't a good example to others, how happy can you be with it yourself

 

my life would be a positive example of happiness... typically ... leave me alone stoner . married , kids , dog, cats , birds .... debts . Asfor my life being a good example to others ... to be honest as a stoner i don't give a fuck .

 

ev

[pipeman]

nice post everest

[pipeman]

The internet isn't real life, (well, maybe for you....)

 

thats an idiotic comment to make when that is the whole point of my post

 

and what I do in my real life is far more than what I've seen many do on the internet. Simply because I don't associate "Luke Skywalker" with my other activities doesn't make the point any less valid.

 

Its not the validity of the point thats the issue.

 

I'm not going to identify myself to you or anyone else as being Luke Skywalker. I will identify my REAL self in public and hold my views very strongly, but I'm not going to name myself IN THIS FORUM, because it wouldn't acheive anything, and would likely be more detrimental to the cause than helpful. Ozstoners is a growing community, and I'm not going to endanger it that way.

 

I fail to see how identifying yourself will endanger Oz Stoners.

 

I do see your point, but what the heck does anything I've proposed doing have to do with identifying myself as Luke Skywalker? I'm writing letters as my real person, not as an internet character. I'm talking to people as a real person, not as an internet character, and I'm voting as a real person, not as an internet character. Have you done any of those things? To be honest, I doubt you've done a single solitary thing to actually help the cause of repealing prohibition in this country. Please prove me wrong.... I know you have a brain, which could be put to good use... But saying it's impossible to change the law makes it so, don't you think?

 

I think we need to be realistic about what we can change. We need to be very moderate.

 

Once again, if you find fault with the idea that we should stand up and be counted as private citizens, (not as internet personas) please let me know what there is wrong with this. Do you want it to remain illegal? Perhaps you do....

 

perhaps you can stop ending your paragraphs with sarcastic quips.

 

Of course we all want dope to be legal. But that is not an immediate goal, because its impossible. If we are successful it will be a gradual process of gaining support, softening then reversing the laws. You're trying to chuck us into reverse while we're still going full steam ahead. I don't think you'll have much success.

 

Attack the idea, if you really disagree with it. Not the person proposing it.

 

I'm not attacking you. I'm proving my point that its the law that protects itself through implied intimidation of anyone that opposes it.

 

I fully agree that everyone should stand up and be counted. That would be great. The point I'm making is that its hard for us to do because in the short term we have so much to lose and little if not nothing to gain. And I'm extending this point to you, in that you are also frightened and is why you won't identify yourself on the internet. To me someone who is not willing to put their real name out on the internet is not someone standing up for something. To me that is someone that BELIEVES in something, but is still intimidated enough by the law to not put their name to their opinion.

[Infinitee]

1. Anyone who is fighting against a government that has oprressed certain substances and their users pretty much since it's creation, not only has the right to be scared, but are probably too stoned if they're not!

 

2. I'm more intimidated by the net than the law. There's more abusers, fighting, shit-kicking, harrassing and bullshitting than in parliament house - and that's saying something. It would be folly to ID yourself netwise in so many ways, it would seem infinitely stupid to bother going over the obvious. Plus, pipe, why are you so adamant about names anyway? What's in a name? Some letters, a few words...you seem to think that our identity is in our christian name, well bugger that We should all count, despite anonymity, status, wealth etc. But as Luke S. said you can't expect to be counted unless you get your opinion out there Some way. Emails, letters or just plain talking to people changes opinions (and builds force behind them.)

 

 

We can't expect to be IN reform, unless we're re-INforming.

 

Everyone reading this....when was the last time you told someone of SOME positive aspect (or dispelled misinformation) about cannabis? This Really is the least you could do (excluding the preffered initiative of Nothing ) and only takes a few minutes of talking to someone you may or may not know.

 

 

It makes a difference. And if you can put it straight enough, you'd be surprised just how many people you can swing round from 'The Dark Side.'

 

I think this belongs to Terence McKenna, but i'm sure whoever had the initiative to invent it won't mind a possible mis-credit...

 

"If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed."

 

Take your grass and ROOT it! (And I ain't talking clones...)

[pipeman]

yes I agree with you Infinitee. I'm not actually asking Luke to put out his real name. I'm simply hilighting to him why he isn't and for the same reason his ideas about cannabis law reform have more grounding in fantasy than reality IMO.