Sex reversal experiment - Silver Thiosulphate

[Bushwacked74]

Ok so Iam going to have a go at makeup g my own feminised seed... so would I be correct in saying if I use colidial silver on a female plant it will produce male flowers and the seed formed from this will be feminised? If I put another female plant of a different strain in same tent will the seed that form on her also be feminised just a cross between the 2 strains !! Is this correct? And at what ratio do I mix the colidial silver with water or do you put it on straight? Is it best to spray hole plant or just a branch

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited April 20, 2018 by Bushwacked74

[Bushwacked74]

Also is there genetic variation in the seed developed where the female has a reversed branch on her. So the seed is almost like a clone in seed form or is there generally genetic variation

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ShitsNGiggles]

Also is there genetic variation in the seed developed where the female has a reversed branch on her. So the seed is almost like a clone in seed form or is there generally genetic variation

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There will be variation unless your reversing a true ibl. Even then their will be variation. Even clones can vary slightly, potency, smell etc.

 

Posted from the OZ Stoners mobile app

[Serrated edge]

Never had a clone that smelled different to the mom .

 

Never had potency issues either ,,, clone acts in same way to all variables like the mom .

 

So if I pick early or late there is a difference ,,,as would be with picking the mom early or late.

 

So any variation you may have seen from a clone would just be the same plant facing different variables .

[ShitsNGiggles]

^ Yes serrated by minor I mean a slight subjective smell or subjective stone. Which is purely subjective. No scientific basis at all. Analysed I'm sure the cannabinoid profile would be identical. My friends recon I got a nose though. So probably as you say just environmental factors in the grow as they usually go outdoors to finish.

 

Posted from the OZ Stoners mobile app

Edited May 1, 2018 by ShitsNGiggles

[Wi-Fi.]

This is a great thread! Full of top info. I am going to have to reverse a 'female only' clone strain i have had for a very long time. It was gifted to me 16 yrs ago by a fellow grower who is no longer with us. This lives on in his name as was his creation and genesis. By reversing her i can at least store her for the future as there's been one or two close calls over the years. Keep up the great threads Naycha ✌

[hermananian]

Never had a clone that smelled different to the mom .

 

Never had potency issues either ,,, clone acts in same way to all variables like the mom .

 

So if I pick early or late there is a difference ,,,as would be with picking the mom early or late.

 

So any variation you may have seen from a clone would just be the same plant facing different variables .

I agree in theory there should be no difference, though using sog I do find a lot of variables, maybe position under light , maybe air flow, maybe genetic drift. Even Claude from Serious seeds thinks genetic drift may exist.  Just dont find many exactly the same in the harvest, close but not exactly. I have always wondered why though !

[doctor_nelson]

I agree in theory there should be no difference, though using sog I do find a lot of variables, maybe position under light , maybe air flow, maybe genetic drift. Even Claude from Serious seeds thinks genetic drift may exist.  Just dont find many exactly the same in the harvest, close but not exactly. I have always wondered why though !

 

 

^{Full disclosure: I'm not a plant genetics expert - I've studied human and rodent genetics and epigenetics - but the basic chemistry and physics of DNA are the same in plants and animals.}

 

tl;dr AFAIK, phenotypes like flavour and potency can certainly vary in a clone compared to a parent and I think that's pretty widely observed, but the underlying mechanisms are likely to be epigenetic (that is, changes in the exposure/methylation/acetylation of an unchanged sequence of DNA) rather than heritable changes in genetic sequence.

 

The actual genetic sequence of a clone's DNA cannot be different from that of the parent because there's no biological mechanism to change the DNA sequence stored in each cell's nucleus when you take a cutting, but epigenetic changes from environmental factors like heat/light/nutrition/pests etc can drive the adult plant into expressing a different phenotypic state than the parent had.

 

In terms of offspring, most mammalian epigenetic "marks" are wiped out during the production of sperm and egg single stranded DNA and of course, there is also recombination during meieosis (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meiosis) to shuffle segments of sequence but some well known epigenetic marks (eg EXOC3L2 in diabetes - see https://www.whatisepigenetics.com/type-2-diabetes-mellitus-and-epigenetics/) are heritable in humans so it's quite likely that there are also heritable epigenetic changes in plants - so the epigenetic state of a female forced to produce male flowers is likely to be altered by that stress - eg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_inheritance so I'd guess that the feminised seeds may well produce plants showing phenotypic variation from both recombination (dicing and slicing of genetic sequence during gamete formation) and epigenetics.

 

S1 offspring (same clone reversed and crossed with itself) will also have lower heterozygosity and so higher risk of recessive traits appearing compared to offspring from two independent plants of the same strain....

Edited June 23, 2018 by doctor_nelson

[Serrated edge]

I agree in theory there should be no difference, though using sog I do find a lot of variables, maybe position under light , maybe air flow, maybe genetic drift. Even Claude from Serious seeds thinks genetic drift may exist.  Just dont find many exactly the same in the harvest, close but not exactly. I have always wondered why though ![/quote

 

Are you saying you get different smell and potency from clones within the same setup and same grow ?

 

After 13,years of cloning ,,and recloning mothers ..the only difference I saw was from differing flower times or from summer to winter grows .

 

only slight change due to environment

 

As far as genetic drift , I don't think that can apply to clones ,,they're all the same ,,.I never saw it and don't believe it happens with clones.

 

Anyone that thinks there is a genetic drift to clones ,,,I'd like them to prove it,,,and that would be pretty hard to do.

[Serrated edge]

^{Full disclosure: I'm not a plant genetics expert - I've studied human and rodent genetics and epigenetics - but the basic chemistry and physics of DNA are the same in plants and animals.}

 

tl;dr AFAIK, phenotypes like flavour and potency can certainly vary in a clone compared to a parent and I think that's pretty widely observed,

 

 

 

observed by Who ?