please help my mother is slowly dying

[Budgiekk]

hey guys would luv for some advice on my problem

 

coupla points

straight perlite

ph 5.8 - 6 run off 6.2

hand waterd when totaly dry

mother plant under fluro's

8.7 ltre pot

plant is about 7 months old

18/6 lights on off

have taken about 4 lots of 6 clones so far off it bout a 6 weeks between

and i did have a low ph problem at the start that was sorted about 6 months ago

 

the problem first arised about 4 weeks ago i diagnosed it as mg def and added epsom salts

plus since then have been flushing weekly with ph 5.8 water

it has progressed worse and is nearly dead

 

 

my replacement mother is also starting to show the ealy signs it did thats why i need to sort it

 

 

 

my air temps have reached 29 only at the hot days (only under fluros and well ventilated) 37 -55% humugity

 

 

i now dont think its mg def whats the chances of it being root bound? or root rot? is it worth pulling it to look at the roots or will that surley push it over?

 

any help in the right direction would be greatly appreciated

 

budgie

[Budgiekk]

sorry dont know what happend to the pix the first is the replacement mother bout 3 months the rest are the very ill

 

 

 

budgie

[Radic]

mothers do get tired and suffer after some time

stress takes it toll

looks a bit like nutrient burn from a toxic build up of waste nutreints in the pot

flush her big time

give her some K

folia spray of kelp would help

and regular flushing is a must

at least once a wk is recomended

 

did you flush regularly in the past 7mts???????????

 

it is very difficult to maintain a mother plant for long periods without a refresh

refreshing the mother is recomended as soon as she show signs of her tiedness

consider cutting your losses and trashing her

consintrate pon the new refreshed mum

she lookz happy

do you havea vibe she is going the same way????????

if so

then clean and flush everyting

now

the whole grow room

inside and out

use h2o2 to sanatize

irey guidance

[bufo marinus]

Trim all the dead branches off. Thin the growth back to new tips.

Trim the root ball in half and break up the remaining root ball, cut any brown roots out, you may need to give it a dunk in water to loosen it all, re-pot with new perlite and give it some more intense lighting HPS or MH as well as some half strength nutrient, take new clones and start a new mother.

[Budgiekk]

Thanks for the replys guys, I've been flushing fortnightly radic though weekly for the last month

- Ill def keep up with the weekly flushing I don't think the other mother is that bad yet I think I was just a bit stoned and feeakin,

I took two clones tonight then took bufo's advice as I pulled up the rootball it was all brown and a little rootbound...... I cut my losses and yanked her:(

I'll put some pix up tomorow

 

I was hoping to get a bit longer out of each mother to keep my stock going but as long as it's due course I'll deal with it!

I was Reading that I should be aerating the water to stop root disease can I still do this if I'm hand watering? Or are the brown

roots just a sideaffect of the tired stressed mother?

 

 

Thanks again heaps radic and bufo;)

 

I read that I should be aerating my water to stop root disease- can I still do this handwatering or am I off the track?

 

Thanks again heaps both radic n bufo.

[bufo marinus]

Mothers in Perlite are flat out lasting 6 months without a root trim to stay healthy. Don't get me wrong perlite is awesome stuff and what I use for bonsai mums, root's love it and grow through it quickly, but, this in itself is the problem.

Don't be afraid to trim the roots.

If there are some brown roots you can go a few different ways - Hydrogen Peroxide or some bacteria like Bio-bugs or natural enzymes like Cannazyme. If you really want you can use all 3, one after the other.

Dunk the whole root ball in a strong sanitising solution mix of H202 (Hy San or Oxy Plus) and water, let it sit and fizz for an hour or so, then dunk the rootball in straight pH water a few times to clean the freshly fizzed (I'm sure that's the tech term) roots and H202 mix from the rootball.

Dunk it a few times.

Repot the plant and use the Cannazyme at the recommended rate, it is supposed to convert dead root matter back into useable nutrient via natural bacterial/microbe activity using natural enzymes. AU60 from Nu-Life will do similar.

If you want to go the next step and have a healthy plant nearby you can introduce healthy bacteria by collecting some run-off and pouring into the re-potted plant as long as it's not too high in EC or alternatively purchase some bacteria like Power Active from Nu-Life. Mostly I think the Cannazyne works well enough but if your grasping at straws it all helps.

And yes yes we all should know that H202 will kill all bacteria good and bad so don't mix with the 'organic' Cannazyme or AU60.

Even hydro growers can appreciate and use organic tools.

 

In regards to why the roots are brown, yes not enough oxygen will do it, a build up of stale nutrient around the roots will do it, fungus gnats attracted to the decaying roots spreading/self seeding the Pythium spore will destroy healthy roots and turn them brown, heat will do it above 26' C as harmful bacteria start to breed and brown the roots.

Perlite by it's very nature 'breathes oxygen' in and out of the rootzone as it dries out and is re-watered, you go clogging things up and soon flushing isn't doing the job it's supposed to, it all goes down hill.

If you want to keep your mums healthy, hand watering is fine, just make sure you water at 'the right time' not too often and not too dry. Too often will drown the roots with not enough exposure to oxygen and too little risks the rootball drying out and heating up = brown roots. Trim your mums root-ball every 4 months and you'll have no dramas.

Bubble your make-up water to rid it of Chlorine and to increase the available oxygen, it also makes setting the pH easier but that is another story on Carbonates.

Low levels of light coupled with falling temps going into winter with a stressed mother plant will be enough to trip it into flower even under 18hrs so watch for signs of flowering around May June and increase the wattage if necessary after re-potting.

 

I don't have a problem discussing things with people willing to focus on logic and common sense, and hope my answers help, if not keep the sensible questions coming and I'll keep responding. Happy gardening

[Budgiekk]

firstly bufo ,thank-you very informative post ive actualy copy n pasted it to my pc for reference when i trim n "fizz" the root ball of my other mother next month

 

now i wish i hadnt culled her just to have a dry run at the process though it doesnt sound to hard

 

 

i think ill also pick up an aerator nyways to cover that base aswell

 

 

heres smoe pics of the rootball

 

(i hope i dont get banned for posting this "DIRTY PORN" )

 

cheers again

budgie

[biggerbuds]

you talking bullshit again bufo ? its just that i smell it

 

PS, do me a favour bufo & clean your teeth,you are making my pc stink of bullshit

[Crunchy]

anyone else read the title of this thread and thought budgeikk was talking about his actual mother?

[bufo marinus]

you talking bullshit again bufo ? its just that i smell it

 

PS, do me a favour bufo & clean your teeth,you are making my pc stink of bullshit

 

funny little man, no, once again your incorrect, although THANK YOU for being stupid enough to get yourself Banned

 

 

I love these trays because they are flat,..................... hehe, how boring, but it's true they suit these small mothers perfectly, the roots are contained yet can grow sideways, ummmm I could go on but you really have to turn a few sets of roots brown to appreciate the simplistic beauty of why they work in lots of different ways for bonsai, for root expansion ease of flushing, ease of moving etc etc etc