New Ballasts cheaper to run?

[Luke Skywalker]

hmm..... I have to point out that you're going to have a hard time getting customer service from china...

 

But they look okay, I'd just tend to say that a HID isn't really necessary for a reasonable mother room, the 130w spectrums are far better in this regard IMO, but personal preference is always an issue. I have a mother room of about 80h x 70d x 45w and a 130w 14000k Spectrum lights that brilliantly for mothers and even cuttings. I also allow plants to develop a little before they go in so it's certainly capable of producing enough light for good growth.

 

Those eb's on ebay aren't wired either, so if you have any hesitation about electricity or your ability to do things safely in that regard it may be best to avoid em. It wouldn't be hard to do mind you, but it may intimidate some who would rather not deal with the live wires if possible....

 

You'll spend more on one in oz, for sure, but you'll also know that if something goes wrong you'll have a good warranty and be able to converse with the person selling it easily. Ebay is all well and good, but there's a lot to be said for physical shopfronts.

 

So yeah, they look okay, for where they come from and what they are, but don't expect anything spectacular, and keep in mind that even small HID lamps put out a lot of heat, and MH lamps particularly suck that way...

 

IMHO.

[RobbieGanjaSeed]

Luke, you may have addressed this in some manner while discussing the light spectrum/strengths of fluoros for mothers, but I'll ask something specific on this.

 

I've always used fluoros for clones and mums, unless the mothers have got too large, then I have gone for the smallest HID I could grab.But since growing last (a couple years back), major changes have been made in fluoros, and I like what I see, just a littkle confused in some ways.

 

I used to use 4 x 40 watt fluor tubes in 2 inch gaps, held in a 4 foot long cupbaord. Finding a 4 foot long cupbaord second hand isn't as easy as you might think, but I didn't want to go that way this time anyhow.

 

So yesterday I wired up a few batten holders to use with compact fluoros for clones.

Seems you can get 100 watt fluoros that draw just 20 watts of power. Even if there's some loss in exageration or unused light spectrums, it's gotta be good. After all, my brother used 10 x 100 watt fluoros in a clone box a while back and I simply couldn't believe the growths.

 

Anyhow, that's the easy part.

 

In the bottom of this cupboard is an area I've resevred for the mothers as they get bigger. Maybe just under a meter or so tall x 800mm. wide and prob 600 deep.

 

I was going to get one of those fluoros that sell in hydro shops, large compact type ones. The shop I saw them in (they were only available in USA when I stopped growing last), sells them for 130 bux. I see them on ebay for 65. Anyway, the problem with them is they need a speciallight holder, maybe similar to a HID, although I haven't looked right into it, I understand there is some fidling somehow.

 

But my whole plan went out the window while at Bunnings. i was getting the batten holders, wire etc to do what I siad fore the clones, when I saw they had compact fluors that claim to release 240 watts of light for just 60 or so watts used.

And they fit straight into any normal batten holder, either edison or bayonette.

 

My questionnow is , are the hydro shops jobs any better than the bunnings ones? Bunnings wants just 20 odd dolars, but the cost isn't the point, just wondering really about light density over distance.

 

In the past, I always stopped plants growing under fluoros, when theyreached about 10 inches tall, becuase the light just didn't have the grunt to reach below that height it seemed.

 

So, here's what it all comes down to, the lights at the hydro shop, the large compact fluoro type things, how intense do they project their light? Do they sufer the same quick loss of light as you move away from the source?

because if so, then I reckon buying the 240 watt standard batten holder jobs woud be best, becuase being cheaper, and smaller, you can buy more for the $$ and fit more for the size, strategically place several of them to make the coverage needed for a larger plant. Like put one on the back of the box, one on the side, one above it, you get the idea. Rather than the one large bulb simply in a conventional "above" position, worrying about light weakening over distance.

 

What do you reckon? What I mean, is the hydro shop large compact style fluoros, do they loose their grunt over distance, just as fluoros allways have? If so, I can't see the value in them used as a conventional "top" light. And reckon sevral would be better, but it's a matter that needs understanding of light desities after say 0-12 inches. What do you know about these hydro shop fluoros in that regard?

 

And thanks for the good word on the electronic ballasts. I just bought a second hand 1k watter, just to get myself kicked off again. But given things go alright from here, I'll be buying the elctronic ones in future, without doubt. Saving money is great, but saving HEAT? In QLd? Man that's worth it even if they cost MORE to run .

Seriously though, I don't think they're all that much more expensive based on the prices you gave, certainly a lot cheaper than the prices i was quoted.

 

cheers

rob

[Luke Skywalker]

The "100w for 20w" and "48w for 240w" light comparisons are between incandescents and compact fluoros. What they're saying is that to get the same amount of light as the 20w or 48w compact fluoros are producing you'd need an incandescent lamp of 100w and 240w respectively. (not that there are 240w incandescents, but that's the conversion they use) A 48w compact fluoro is only comparable to a 130w compact fluoro in the sense that a 400w HPS is comparable to a 1000w hps. Same light, but one is shiteloads more intense. The comparisons on the packages of those nelson lamps are for electricity usage between incandescents and cf's.

 

There is a benefit to using multiple 48w lamps in standard batten holders over the single lamp, and that's coverage. But it wouldn't be more efficient really and those lamps aren't really designed for plant growth. They do okay, (I once had a smaller mum room running on one of them) but I found the 130w Spectrum lamps much better. You'd probably get good results either way, but the 130w lamps rationalise things a bit better, and means less cords and battens floating all over the place.

 

The difference between the ones you may see for 60 bucks and the ones you see for 130 bucks is mostly quality. The Spectrum branded lamps are also available in a 14,000K spectrum which is very intense blue, and excellent for vegetative growth. The cheaper ones only come in 6400 and 2700K. The Spectrum lamps are also safety approved, quality ticked and are reliable, whereas the others may not have this certification and are likely cheap chinese knockoffs. If it's a genuine "Spectrum" lamp then go for it, but if it's one of the others, I'd avoid it IMHO. There are other brands coming out on the market though, so you may find that the $ you save might be worth it, but I couldn't in all conscience recommend them.

 

They fit into a standard HID socket, E39 or E40 mogul socket. So if you've got a spare gullwing shade or vertical light socket then just use that. The only thing you need is an adaptor to change the round earth on the plug of the mogul to a flat earth to plug straight into the wall (self ballasted). Course, you could rewire the plug to be a flat earth, but that depends on how confident you are with wiring things.

 

They put out around 12,000 lumens which is comparable in efficiency to a 400w HPS. (remembering that a 400w hps uses something like 530w really) The rules for light intensity from a hid and from a fluoro are the same, but you'll be able to get plants much closer to a fluoro than an equivalently sized/bright HID.

 

If I was concerned about depth I'd consider adding maybe 2x 48 w compacts as side/corner lighting to help with intensity, but I reckon you'd be right with the room depth. Just set up the lamp so it can be raised and lowered as needed as you would in a standard growing room and you can pretty much eliminate any intensity issues.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Skywalker