doubts on cannabis for pain relief

[sols]

Doubts on cannabis for pain relief

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/Health/story_50619.asp

 

Cannabis does not provide any better pain relief than a drug contained in common headache tablets, according to an Australian study.

 

The findings will come as a blow to groups advocating the legalisation of cannabis for medicinal purposes, who cite the drug's supposed pain-killing properties as one of its main therapeutic benefits.

 

A study of the synthetic cannabis pill, Nabilone, found it gave patients no more pain relief than codeine, which is contained in over-the-counter headache pills and cold and flu tablets.

 

Nabilone has been available as an anti-nausea treatment for cancer patients under a special federal government access scheme since the 1970s.

 

Dr Dilip Kapur, of Adelaide's Flinders Medical Centre, studied Nabilone in 80 patients with chronic pain and nerve damage.

 

 

 

 

Half were given a codeine-like drug and the others were given Nabilone. After six weeks the treatments were swapped, with neither group knowing what they were getting.

 

Dr Kapur said neither medication was particularly useful but codeine provided better pain relief than Nabilone.

 

However, there were arguable benefits for those getting the cannabis drug.

 

"Nabilone has an equivalent effect on patients as recreational use of cannabis when used in similar doses," he told the Flinders Medical Centre newsletter.

 

Dr Kapur said the study provided strong evidence that cannabis was not beneficial for treating strong pain.

 

However, it could be helpful in certain circumstances, he said.

 

The NSW government earlier this year gave the go-ahead for a controlled trial of the drug for medicinal purposes.

 

The Australian Medical Association (AMA) has lent its support to the trial, saying there was evidence that cannabis was a useful drug for patients suffering wasting, chronic pain and nausea.

 

 

 

amazing powers of deduction huh?

[syk613]

Quote

A study of the synthetic cannabis pill, Nabilone, found it gave patients no more pain relief than codeine, which is contained in over-the-counter headache pills and cold and flu tablets.

 

Codeine is like heroin in fact the brains receptors only accepts heroin or diacetylmorphinne after it is turned into morphine but it is very lipophillic so it enters the brain quick and is metabolised vquick so the effect is a heavier rush, codeine (a littlte less potent) you will find over the counter around 8-10mg (not sure) and on script panadeine forte has more I think it is 30 mg but the good shit for the cancer patients is kept locked ip in a dangerous drugs cabinet IE Schedule 8 drugs Dangerous drugs and drugs of addiction or some shit.(also dex amphet and maybe some form of coke (dentist) and there is straight morph and codeine there (apart from cough syrups but they are very hard to get) plus other stuff I would imagine. So basically opiates and all there synthetic derivatives all tend to produce tolerance and dependance plus addiction. These drugs if taken in quantity or with alchol can kill a person vquick esp. appl who are tolerant to the pain killing effects so have more only to find their respiation and pulse slowing... If a regime could be found were addiction/tolerance was decreased by also using mj with conventional drugs then it may help to improve the quality of life for many acute and chronic pain sufferers

 

This study uses one derivative designed as an anti-emetic, mj has lots a forms of THC all activating different recptors to different degrees and opposite effects at some receptors and with some agents, Therefore using just one form is stupid and illogical and really it only says this form is not that good, so now they have to move on to one of the other cannabinoids and do the same test, their powers of deduction also worrie me along with the way they are going about the study in the 1st place, nature has produced some of the most toxic and also amazing plants with strong healing powers so why limit the usage to one derivative when we and mj have been evolving for donkeys, using only one derivative makes no sense IMO if you want to treat many different chronic ailments or side-effects.

There should be more investigation into different strains and the forms of THC and their med uses as brought up in another thread. I could ramble on for ages so let me just say this, what is above is opinion only and some or all may be completely erroneous so take all info with as many grains of salt as you would like. peace

[RobbieGanjaSeed]

I've been in pain every day for so many years I don't care to remember. I've had codiene, (the weakest of the opiates) right through to fentanyl; the strongest (40 times stronger than Heroin).

 

I've injected opiates IM and IV and swallow more strong opiate drugs per day than anyone I have ever known. I feel at least somewhat partially qualified to comment.

 

I've always said, and researched, that pot cannot replace opiates as serious pain control. It just isn't designed to chemically. It acts in a completley different way.

 

But I've sat here in my humble abode, after taking 1300mg of oxycontin , which is (off the top of my head) around 2000mg of Morphine, which again off the top of my head is prob. just under a gram of heroin a day equivalent. So I have about a 300 dollar a day habit of opiates (if I had to use street gear). All prescibed.

 

I've used that much, and still had extreme pain getting through, which after taking that much hard drug leaves one exhausted and depressed. I've been so out of my mind, and have no idea where I am, and still thinking of topping myself from the pain, that I don't think I can face another minute.

 

Then, after a nice joint, I'm laughing and talking with my wife and best friend. Watching the tele, or going out for a drive or some other distraction.

 

Sure it doesn't stop the pain per sae, and in minor pain, it may not have any benifit, because codiene is so effective in minor pain. But for long term dibiltating pain, it has benifits that are not measureable in traditional terms. But which have more than likely kept me in the land of the living.

 

Why don't these clowns listen to the people who want to use it, instead of cross examining us as if we have some alterior motive. Like our goal might be happiness. Gee, thats a crime.

 

c ya.

rob

 

PS. The other thing these bastards dont figure into the acount is how many people out there are going to have to feed an addiction to their pain killers for the rest of their depressed lives, while pot doesnt have such a slavery to it. Nor do they figure into the account that these trial patients are on codiene today, but this time next year, they'll be on low doses of oxycodone, then on higher doses of same, with a few branching into MS. Contin (Morphine Sulphate), and even right up to Fentanyl. No opiate can remain effective for long. It has to be increased as the years go by. there isnt any exception. Tolerance is as real as the Sun in the sky. It can't be avoided, a person MUSt increase dose to keep in the effectyive pain control area, as the brain creates more and more opiate receptors that require more andmore opiate to fil them.

 

They also don't figure that regardles of if I feel pain or not, I have to take this stuff at insane levels each and every 4 hours around the clock, just to stay off severe withdrawals. Nor can I drive a car, even if I don't feel impaired, because if I have an accident, I'm off to jail for driving under the influence. If I could get by on just pot, my driving would be restricted only to when I am under it's influence. But with opiates, I have it in me all the time. But then pot has similar legal ramifications on that I suppose.

 

Anyway, it's the slavery to opiates that most of us ain patients want the pot for. it's such a more agreeable drug to use.

 

c ya

[syk613]

Robbie I see what you mean and agree with everything you have said, Specific strains need to be investigated in respect to particular ailments and then quantifing receptor/drug affinities and eftects both globally and at the molecular level etc would be another step towards making full use of a selectvely demonised plant, Hell nictotine is one of the most toxiic compounds on the planet (and not smoking that is a different story)

eg possible cancer med uses: Strain that gives the muchies to help as an anti-emetic and also as an adjunct to opiate pain relief, however differerent forms of pain or even the same subjective painfull feeling eg miagraine might be produced for v different reasons and so THC (and other derivatives) may only be effective in some of these cases depending on receptor location and CNS activation etc IMO.

 

As far as the activity of codiene goes yes I was wrong codeine is a weak agonist of the 3 main types of opioid receptors as for the weakest their are weaker but these are probably used in the clinic in different situations, although I must question this info as it states methadone and codeine do not produce dependance ? This is completely diffrent from my experiences so I wonder what the original source of the info in this book was.

Edited October 20, 2003 by syk613

[widowdoc]

Amen to that Robbie. I know were your coming from man, I'm a fellow chronic pain sufferer with rheumatiod and a back falling to pieces. I started on pain killers codoene panadeine fortes etc in 89. I've kept my dose to 300mg kapanol (morphine) a day.

The pot lets me function,gives me an appetite, and makes my day enjoyable, the alternative is you just sit around getting depressed & suicidal.

Fuck it - it should be our choice.

[RobbieGanjaSeed]

Methadone and codiene are highly addictive.

 

The poppy plant has many alkaloids, and Mophine and codiene are the highest represented. So if someone is addicted to poppy tea, and there's quiet a few that are, thats whatthey're basically addicted to. Althoughthere really are alot of addcitive substances within each pod.

 

but in America, codiene can't be bought over the counter, and many of them contact dicey pharmacy companiesa round the world, mainly in Gebraltor I believe, and of course mexico. They go through a fair bit of stuffing around then, to perculate the panadol off the codiene to get enough to make a dose. I'd call that addicted.

 

Recently I had trouble getting pain killers from a doc. because he said his best friend was addicted to codiene, and he didn't leave out the fact the guy addicted is another doc.

 

And for methadone withdrawals/horror stories, just do a search.

 

Now excuse me while I go back to throwing up. I'm presently tryinging to cutmy medicine back a bit. Just a coupl pills a day less, and I have to pay with panick attacks and sickness.

 

Cheers all.

rob

[syk613]

Thanks for the reply Robbie, the book (ref in a thread I started about THC effects and pharmacology) lists this info in the text and in a table states methadone results in a slow recovery and therefore attenuated withdrawals Thanks again for taking the time to post I should have had a bit of a look at the figures etc.