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Questions for Jan Copeland and the NCPIC

NCPIC Jan Copeland Medical Cannabis Sativex NCPIC Questions cannabis

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#21
dani

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This can be a really positive thing if given the chance.. It's important to see how the other side comes to their conclusions and how much influence they have with our governments in forming drug policies that affect us.. Maybe this could be looked at as an opportunity for members, especially those that need cannabis for illness, to educate NCPIC and it's representatives..
It's important to see every one's side in a debate, and try to correct peoples misconceptions with supportable facts. There aren't many people who have more facts and knowledge than a lot of members here at OS..
:peace:
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#22
Psychonaut

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Well that sounds nice dani but you will have to forgive my total skepticism, I probably made some stupid comments there as well, I am sure they do some decent projects and work.

Just seems like the same old story to me though, some organization taking points of view, then finding or even worse creating suitable studies to then back it up regardless of any larger perspective or comparisons with much larger issues and health problems in society.

I guess the thing that annoys me most is the whole approach to me is just the denial of the whole human experience, people have and always will experiment and this kind of stance does not work. I do not doubt there are some risks with cannabis and with certain people but there are risks in almost everything in life, some greater than others, this is where the perspective is lost relating to cannabis and its whats drives me most crazy on the issue.

When the NCPIC change their name to the National Cannabis Treatment & Information Center and stop trying to tell everyone why they should not use cannabis, let me know.
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#23
MongyMan

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Please restrict posts in this thread to Questions for the NCPIC

If you want to discuss this thread or the NCPIC and have no questions, please do that in this thread here The NCPIC Discussion Thread

Any post not containing Questions for the NCPIC will be deleted from now on to avoid cluttering up this thread.


Peace MongyMan
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"Cannabis Prohibition Laws Cultivate Organised Crime"


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Cannabis was called Cannabis when Australia was founded. Marijuana was a mexican word unknown in Australia until American Reefer Madness arrived.

 

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#24
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1) We receive around $3million per year which is shared among the 8 consortium partners


Who are the 8 consortium partners?

Does the NCPIC officially recognise that cannabis has many known and many possible medical uses if used via forms of ingestion other than smoking?

If not, why not?

If yes, will you please state clearly on the homepage of the NCPIC website that the NCPIC recognises this or if you are unable or unwilling to do this please explain why?

If yes, will you please state clearly on the homepage of the NCPIC website that the NCPIC recognises there is a distinct difference between the medical use of cannabis in the Australian community and the non-medical use of cannabis in the Australian community or if you are unable or unwilling to do this please explain why?


Peace MongyMan
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#25
iamnotacop

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Hello Jan, Thankyou for the opportunity.

Q1. I assume you are familiar with Professor David Nutt. My question is do you fear for your job if you actually spoke the truth? (but then again you created your own job, no? lol)

q.2 Do you agree/believe that Cannabis causes less harm to Australian society over tobacco or Alcohol?

q.3 How come it is called such a dangerous drug when not one person has died from using it?

q.4 What studies has the NCPIC read in relation to using Cannabis as a form of alcohol withdrawal aid?

q.5 Do you personally feel the prohibition or "war on drugs" is winning or even winnable?

q.6 As a member of the "Australian Professional Society on Alcohol and Drugs" would you prefer me to be an abusive everyday alcoholic or a calm chronically intoxicated cannabis user?

q.7 Do you feel the punishments for posession are cruel and archaic or are just about right? I mean how do you feel about non violent drug offenders living with murderers and rapists and thieves?

q.8 I assume the NCPIC has done/read research indicating that punishments act in no way as a deterrant to a persons willingness to use Cannabis, so why do you not speak out against the unfair jailing of non violent drug users?

q.9 Do you agree that a patient constantly worrying/anxiety about the repercussions of Cannabis (as in being busted and jailed) is actually more dangerous to the mind than the actual cannabis use itself?

q.10 Do you think that Dr Wodak is more informed on the subject than yourself, but you have just managed to get a higher soap box with more funding because your incorrect and biased view fits in with Government propaganda, I mean policy?

q.11 Remembering that all studies point out that "Children" find it easier to obtain alcohol and cigarettes rather than Cannabis, how does the NCPIC live with itself knowing that it is only keeping the status quo and leaving our children vulnerable?

q.12 Do you feel a bit silly trying to tell everyone that you get paid to tell everyone how bad pot is when everyone knows what you say is just plain shit?

q.13 Do you think if I had the same funding and the same levels of access to the same studies and reports that you have, that I could find completely different views than yourself? Who would be right?

q.14 How would the NCPIC go if it was only allowed to use studies/reports that had come from sources other than pharmaceutical companies/fronts.



Once again thankyou for your time and I await your answers. But then again I wont hold my breath.
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#26
Jan C

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Hi,
I'll make my replys following each comment to keep track, Jan

Hi Jan, thanks for getting back to us :)

ok so looking at your scientific research reply, i interpret it in layman's terms,...correct me if im wrong but i read it as though these people who`ve produced these stats are getting their information from psychologists, psychiatrists and doctors who`ve given their opinion? and those opinions are based on people aged from 13 to 18 over a short amount of time? .....mmmm kay :scratchin:
thats not very solid research imo...and to say that cannabis increases "sexual aggression" is outright wrong :ack:
if this were true the prison systems would be FULL of rapists due to Cannabis :rolleyes:


I made no comment on the merits of the particular paper I was just using it as AN example of the kind of literature that is around when queried if any existed. Sexual aggression is of course one of the most controversial so a high risk choice but we see similar relationships with alcohol and it does not mean prisons are full of alcoholics but of sexually agressive people who also use alcohol! The study was quote good - it followed 851 men over 4 years so I don't think it can be dismissed so readily

from my experience, doctors, psychiatrists & psychologists dont tend to believe what i report, and 100% of the time end up offering some sort of anti depressant. :bleh:


I'm sorry if you have had negative experiences with health workers but I tend not to believe anyone 100% of the time in any aspect of my life - it's a pretty high bar


you say you`re interested in helping emote indigenous communities who are concerned about the aggression of some young males in particular when unable to access $ for cannabis and are experiencing withdrawal as it is very disruptive to these small communities and causing distress among female elders.

oohh kay ......why not just legalize it? :wacko:
the reason they cant get money for it is because the prohibition has caused the prices to go through the roof.
if it were readily accessible for these people the problem would be solved :rolleyes:


Even if cannabis were legal it would not be free and it is the remoteness of these communities that make them easy to exploite for a variety of commodities

and im curious, these interventions you talk of, where NCPIC conduct their own original research projects.....is that a collective of people who dont use Cannabis that sit around throwing ideas at each other, or are the general public invited to say their piece?


I do not ask my staff if they use cannabis and make no assumptions. We certainly have robust discussions from a variety of perspectives.

also, i never mention anything about smoking when i asked about human trials..... - i understand that smoking any vegetable matter would be carcinogenic.....but i dont think ingesting it would be harmful.
while the Cannabis might have been grown organically, sativex, marinol and dronabinol are all man made with additives ...not to mention they`re NOT readily available to the general public at reasonable prices. >:(


Sativex is not synthetic it is a botanical extract of the whole plant but with known levels of THC & CBD and hopefully after testing will be available at a reasonably price (& perhaps subsidised by the PBS even)

Cannabis resin can be extracted naturally and consumed/used in a number of ways......i dont see the problem there :nea:

Thanks again,

Me :bongon:


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#27
Jan C

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Hello Jan, Thankyou for the opportunity.

Q1. I assume you are familiar with Professor David Nutt. My question is do you fear for your job if you actually spoke the truth? (but then again you created your own job, no? lol)

Yes of course I have heard of him. I did not create my own job I applied for it as part of an international search. What work do you do?

q.2 Do you agree/believe that Cannabis causes less harm to Australian society over tobacco or Alcohol? Yes, 3 wrongs don't make a right

q.3 How come it is called such a dangerous drug when not one person has died from using it? I have never called it a dangerous drug but I have concerns regarding associated risks

q.4 What studies has the NCPIC read in relation to using Cannabis as a form of alcohol withdrawal aid? None - it is not sensible and would never get ethical approval. Alcohol withdrawal is potentially life threatening and should be managed medically

q.5 Do you personally feel the prohibition or "war on drugs" is winning or even winnable? I think the notion of a war on drugs is unhelpful to say the least

q.6 As a member of the "Australian Professional Society on Alcohol and Drugs" would you prefer me to be an abusive everyday alcoholic or a calm chronically intoxicated cannabis user? I would prefer you were neither (a bit spooky you looking up my memberships!)

q.7 Do you feel the punishments for posession are cruel and archaic or are just about right? I mean how do you feel about non violent drug offenders living with murderers and rapists and thieves? Possession of small amounts of cannabis for personal use is largely decriminalised in Australia so your question is not based in fact. I think the US laws on the other hand are of serious concern

q.8 I assume the NCPIC has done/read research indicating that punishments act in no way as a deterrant to a persons willingness to use Cannabis, so why do you not speak out against the unfair jailing of non violent drug users? Because it is not relevant in Australia

q.9 Do you agree that a patient constantly worrying/anxiety about the repercussions of Cannabis (as in being busted and jailed) is actually more dangerous to the mind than the actual cannabis use itself? No

q.10 Do you think that Dr Wodak is more informed on the subject than yourself, but you have just managed to get a higher soap box with more funding because your incorrect and biased view fits in with Government propaganda, I mean policy? Alex has a very large soap box of his own

q.11 Remembering that all studies point out that "Children" find it easier to obtain alcohol and cigarettes rather than Cannabis, how does the NCPIC live with itself knowing that it is only keeping the status quo and leaving our children vulnerable? You've lost me on this one, we are all responsible for protecting vulnerable children

q.12 Do you feel a bit silly trying to tell everyone that you get paid to tell everyone how bad pot is when everyone knows what you say is just plain shit? No

q.13 Do you think if I had the same funding and the same levels of access to the same studies and reports that you have, that I could find completely different views than yourself? Who would be right? No, the information I use is in the public domain - go for it

q.14 How would the NCPIC go if it was only allowed to use studies/reports that had come from sources other than pharmaceutical companies/fronts.

There is almost no research on pharmaceuticals for cannabis and almost all of them show they don't help and aren't funded by pharmaceutical companies. The big conspiracy theory that all mental health research is funded by pharmaceutical companies is just that. We work beyond health in education etc where big pharma has no role

Once again thankyou for your time and I await your answers. But then again I wont hold my breath. Sorry to disappoint yet again


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#28
Jan C

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Who are the 8 consortium partners?


This is avai;able on the website but here goes: NDARC, NDRI, NCETA, Lifeline, TNF, AIC, Turning Point & ORYGEN

Does the NCPIC officially recognise that cannabis has many known and many possible medical uses if used via forms of ingestion other than smoking?

If not, why not?


We have no role in medical cannabis so no
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#29
Jan C

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Well that sounds nice dani but you will have to forgive my total skepticism, I probably made some stupid comments there as well, I am sure they do some decent projects and work.

Just seems like the same old story to me though, some organization taking points of view, then finding or even worse creating suitable studies to then back it up regardless of any larger perspective or comparisons with much larger issues and health problems in society.


I understand your need to vent but it is not in the interest of Oz Stoners to accuse professors from Go8 universities of scientific fraud

I guess the thing that annoys me most is the whole approach to me is just the denial of the whole human experience, people have and always will experiment and this kind of stance does not work. I do not doubt there are some risks with cannabis and with certain people but there are risks in almost everything in life, some greater than others, this is where the perspective is lost relating to cannabis and its whats drives me most crazy on the issue.


I think the alcohol industry would agree with you

When the NCPIC change their name to the National Cannabis Treatment & Information Center and stop trying to tell everyone why they should not use cannabis, let me know.


You don't know how much I would love to change our name to that!!
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#30
iamnotacop

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Hi Jan, I would like to ask a few questions about this recent press release.
http://www.abc.net.a...11/s3132596.htm

MATTHEW LARGE: The risks for older people is about a doubling of the risk, so instead of having a one per cent chance of developing schizophrenia you are probably likely to have about a two per cent chance of developing schizophrenia.


My question is can the NCIPC please provide the relavent data to tell us how many Australians have schizophrenia, and how many of them are/have been Cannabis users.??

Can the NCIPC please provide the International statistics for Schizophrenia and Cannabis users, by region??

==================

You mentioned the Trimbos Institute so you will be aware of this study....
http://www.ukcia.org...hizophrenia.pdf

1.The self-medication hypothesis. Schizophrenia causes
cannabis use because those already suffering from
schizophrenia, or its symptoms, use cannabis in an
attempt to cope with the negative symptoms (depressed
or blunted affect) that stem from schizophrenia. People
may also use cannabis in an attempt to suppress the
side-effects of antipsychotic medication. The selfmedication
hypothesis thus implies a reversed
causality.
2.Other drugs hypothesis. Cannabis use is often accompanied
by the use of other drugs like amphetamines,
opiates and cocaine, and it is not cannabis but the
other drugs that are responsible for the later onset of
schizophrenia.
3.Confounding hypothesis. Both cannabis use and schizophrenia
are brought about by one or more common
etiological factors. The relationship between cannabis
use and schizophrenia thus is spurious.
4.Interaction hypothesis. Cannabis use may cause schizophrenia,
but only in persons already at risk of becoming
schizophrenic. In other words, these persons are in
some way vulnerable (genetically or otherwise) and
cannabis use only triggers the onset of schizophrenia.
5.Etiological hypothesis. Cannabis use makes its own
(unique) contribution to the risk of becoming
schizophrenic.



Would you agree that we are talking about very small numbers of people who suffer an illness whose cause is unknown. Their are too many variables for an exact answer so there should be no misinformation given to the Australian people. These reports are inaccurate. You studied a bunch of flawed studies, and came up with results that are really not that big a deal. one third of Australians have used Cannabis. 165 Million worldwide?
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WARNING/DISCLAIMER The OZ Stoners cannabis community contains information regarding cannabis & other drugs; it is designed for mature (18+) audiences only. This site in no way condones the use of cannabis by minors. The content here within this cannabis community is for educational & entertainment purposes only. Any buying/selling or trading of illegal cannabis seeds, clones, flowers, resin or oil is strictly prohibited within this cannabis community.