The ABS......getting more nosey by the day

[Rocker]

What are they really looking for if you give blood and urine tests?

 

Okay, Cannabis isn't mentioned here but how long will it be before governments go looking?

 

Daily fine for refusing to take part in national health survey • By Sue Dunlevy

• From: The Daily Telegraph

• May 19, 2010 12:00AM

 

UP TO 50,000 people face a fine of $110 a day if they refuse to divulge information on their health and lifestyle to Australian Bureau of Statistics researchers.

The Australian Health Survey announced in last week's Budget will be the most comprehensive research on the health of Australians ever undertaken and will be jointly funded by the National Heart Foundation.

But the 50,000 people chosen to take part will be compelled to do so.

 

Participants will be weighed and measured and will be asked to give a blood and urine sample.

They will also be asked detailed questions on what they drink and eat and their physical activity.

 

The ABS said participation "is ultimately compulsory for those chosen by random sampling to ensure the survey accurately represents the Australian population as a whole".

However, participants would only be compelled to answer questions, providing a blood and urine sample and weighing in would be voluntary.

 

While it would seek co-operation of those selected, the ABS said it had the power to direct unwilling respondents to provide information.

"If a participant was directed in writing and continued to refuse to comply, they may be prosecuted under the Census and Statistics Act 1905 and a fine may be imposed," a spokesman for the ABS said.

"A fine of up to $110 per day may be imposed until such time as the information is supplied."

Australian Medical Association president Dr Andrew Pesce said the survey would provide valuable information for designing preventative health policies. "I can't imagine the Government has any intention of prosecuting people who don't co-operate," he said.

 

National Heart Foundation chief Lyn Roberts said she understood the survey would be conducted in a similar way to the ABS's National Health Survey.

"The difference is a voluntary component allowing participants to provide biomedical data which will allow policy-makers to use verified data on their health for the first time rather than self-reported data, which we know ... can be unreliable."

 

 

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw-...i-1225868408747

[SHEEPinWOLFskin]

The ABS said participation "is ultimately compulsory for those chosen by random sampling to ensure the survey accurately represents the Australian population as a whole".

However, participants would only be compelled to answer questions, providing a blood and urine sample and weighing in would be voluntary.

 

Lucky for them the samples are voluntary. I will NEVER voluntary give up my blood!!

[bbud666]

well i seriously hope they dont come knockin on my door cause i will be gettin fined..i wont even tell em so much as my name let alone give samples..fuck them..

what is this, china, nazi germany??? we are a democracy with freedom of choice

(suposedly anyway) not a communist nation where people are forced to supply personal info to the govt or be punished.. so what happens when you dont pay the fine? do you become a "political prisoner"?? have they finished the concentration camp yet??..oh wait they have..on xmas island.....

fuck them, i`ll give jack shit by force.. unfortunately im stubborn..most would cut thier nose off to spite thier face, i would cut my head off to spite my body if forced into a corner.....

bout all ill tell them is kiss me where it stinks..maybe i should just pretend to be a deaf mute if they come around..... or if its a chick that comes i could be a sex addicted perve (all good techniques if you like fuckin with the godsquaders when they come around)

hey if she dont like me sniffin her tits(hat tip to vivian in the young ones) then get the fuck out of my house...

 

seriously though. its a severe invasion of rights and privacy if you are not a 100% willing participant..so now what, are people gonna have a criminal record or prison record becuase of a survey???? bullshit, whats thier real motive behind this move?? what are they really trying to find out??? i`ll bet sue dunlevey didnt print that bit of info..no offence sue if you read on here.. because if they are willing to fine you or worse for not participating, no hang on, co-operating is thier chosen word( makes it sound worse) then thier is more at stake for them than just a few statistics.....

 

i think its a disgusting and rights raping proposal..well another 1 anyway.....

well thats my two, naa, five cents worth....cheers

[louise]

What are they really looking for if you give blood and urine tests?

 

They are really looking to see if you told the truth in the survey... eg. If you tick yes to low cholesterol diet then your blood work will demonstrate that in the ratio of low to high density lipids and total lipid count.

 

Okay, Cannabis isn't mentioned here but how long will it be before governments go looking?

 

Why would they bother? Does cannabis have that much impact on health? Anyway, the only bit of the survey that is mandatory is providing verbal answers to the questions asked... and over that bit the govt has always had constitutional power to fine if you don't comply.

 

The day they can fine us for not providing blood or urine is the day this is worth is worth calling "news".

[Budman2012]

Interesting Story Rocker , thanx

 

@ bbud ... heheheh

 

And fair enough Lou lou ,

The blood and urine tests aren't mandatory ... also these 50,000 are volunteers anyway (judging from this story) ... (anyone here a volunteer in this btw? ... oh , suprise suprise ... I'm sure it will be a fair and accurate representation of the Australian public lmfao! bet they got heaps of NT long-grassers in there too aye)

But ... seemingly the pressure is on these people to FULLY take part in this , including the samples.

The article says "However, participants would only be compelled to answer questions, providing a blood and urine sample and weighing in would be voluntary."

So either they are saying that ONLY the questions need be answered accuratly without samples (in which case ofc it's totally moot (regarding these suggested fines) because it's all anectdotal evidence so there can be no claim of anyone 'lying') ... or ... The Volunteers certainly Will be 'Compelled' to also take the blood and Urine sample tests also in order to cross-reference the anectdotal with the fluid samples (in which case we aren't hearing the whole story)

 

Either way I think this is just the usual media sensationalism as per usual

 

And on the issue of why would they bother testing for Cannabis? ... um , Hello??? Ofc they could consider it ... and who's to say the people who don't comply with the bodily sample testing won't be put on a list somewhere. It's naive to think there aren't numerous lists on everyone for everything these days ... ask ASIO

 

Oh , and btw SHEEPinWOLF ...

Lucky for them the samples are voluntary. I will NEVER voluntary give up my blood!!

They have been taking blood samples from Newborn Humans in Australia since the 70's ... we don't get a choice in that matter unfortunatly ... SO there is a good chance that most people under 40 already have their DNA on record ... bugger!

 

Aaand that's all from me ... Cheerz

 

Budman

[Rocker]

Budman2012, I understand the 50,000 are being selected at random. That means any one of us could be 'chosen.'

 

I too wonder about the pressure that might be applied to have blood and urine tests taken.

BTW what are most urine tests for? Think about it.

 

Finally, is this the thin end of the wedge? Where and when does this invasion of privacy stop?

[louise]

Budman, funny you should mention the NT, in the 1990's I worked on NHS (National Health Survey) around Leanyer and out at Palmerston and yes, we did interview as best we could all ethnic groups in the community. Long grass people are included but the sampling method is different.

 

When it comes to sampling in town, addresses of households, not individual people are selected at random. Once a household is nominated they are telephoned or visited if there is no phone to see allocate participants. This is done by gender and age characteristics to produce an eventual sample across all ages groups of equal gender.

 

Sampling fringe dwellers takes a fair bit of sitting under trees and hoping someone might agree to have a chat. it's a bit different.

 

If your household is nominated, they never need to know your name, unless (of course) you chose to give it to them. As a survey participant you only have to answer the questions asked... that they can compel you to do, but they can not compel you to stand on the scales for weighing or stand still to be measured. When I was doing it there was no blood or urine samples to collect. I expect that will have upped the pay rate too for survey workers... you needed a nursing background to administer the survey but you didn't a venapuncture certificate.

 

Mind, they will ask you if you'd like a summary of your health status, and if you do, they will require a name to go with the data. Don't be conned all it's going to give you is your body mass index and you can do that online for nothing if you really want to know it.

 

Interesting you mention the Guthrie Test, unfortunately you're a bit off the mark there. The single drop of blood collected from newborns for PKU screening is used up during the screening test. There isn't anything left to 'keep on file' apart from whether the babe is going to be able to eat bananas in the future without it damaging her/his IQ.

 

It's probably obvious that I am no fan of conspiracy theories. And it's especially true of ones that I know, because of the sort of work I've done, are impractical. When the Guthrie test card arrives at the lab, the small dry dots of blood are punched out with a hole punch and dropped into a googey plate of gelatin to see what grows. The remaining card, once the details are transcribed, is binned.

 

What's on file? The googey agar and any bacteria that grew, or maybe the card which I identifies that the patient in bed no.X had a baby that had the Guthrie test done?

 

So the likelihood that 40 years worth of dna data is stored in some 'database' or vault is very low indeed.

 

edit - Rocker - urine testing can quickly reveal hidden disease states... eg. diabetes mellitus, kidney and liver problems as well as prostrate cancer.

 

Again, nothing even slightly sinister.

Edited May 19, 2010 by lou lou

[bbud666]

Again, nothing even slightly sinister.

 

nothing personal to you lou lou, you obviously know what your talking about so i wouldnt argue with you by i do have to wonder, if there is nothing sinister going on, why is it mandatory? why does 1 not have a choice whether they participate in ANY way????

[louise]

You do have a choice bbud666, if selected you can decline to participate and give the Federal govt $110 for the privilege.

 

ed- btw the power to compel comes from Section 51(xi) of the Australian federal constitution.

Edited May 20, 2010 by lou lou

[bbud666]

You do have a choice bbud666, if selected you can decline to participate and give the Federal govt $110 for the privilege.

bit a contradiction of terms there isnt it???

you have a choice but you pay 110 a day for that priviliedge..

maybe in your fantasy world thats a priviledge but where i grew up thats known as a rort.. not a freedom of choice in any way.. i have a serious problem with the public health officials and workers that think they know whats best for others..we are minus a daughter thanks to thier incompetence.. and downright ignorance when i told them there was a problem..

 

im an educated person and i am quite capable of determining whether or not i am healthy, i dont need some prying dick to come to my house ask dickie questions and tell me whether im healthy or not..as for the rest of the population, no offence to any1 but i couldnt give 10 pigmy fucks about the state of thier health..im only intersted in mine and my family..

 

oh and section 1 of the federal bbud constitution gives me the power to say fuck you i aint co operating and i aint payin you shit..besides, basic democratic human rights override that federal constitution..even a legal aid solicitor would get you out of that 1..otherwise we live under a corrupt and tyrranical dictatorship, no different to saddam or hitler.. and not a free democratic society..

we either have freedom of choice or we dont and unless the definition of " free democratic society" has recently changed, small issue or big, we have a choice in this country....if we dont then its purely by force...no ifs or butts about it..

 

well im sorry, but a prison cell doesnt scare me( which is what they would do if you refuse to pay the fines).. so they better think up some other form of persuasion to "force" me to co operate or pay or anything.. as i said in a previous post, i will not be forced into anything by any1..im not trying to sound like a hero cause it aint ment that way at all.. im normal like every1 else but the 1st half of my life thus far wasnt pleasant so there isnt anything they could do that i would consider scary enough to make me fall in line...

 

sorry for the rant but anything to do with being forced or people trying to prove the rightousness of that onto me is a very personal and touchy subject for me..believe it or not i have been exreeeeemly restrained in this thread and im not into startin shit or "online arguements" so no more for me on this 1...

 

peace all...