bonzai bubbling mothers

[pipeman]

What I'm trying to do is keep a few different mothers, up to 6 or so in a small space. Maybe even in a rubber storage container like my cloning tub

 

I'm hoping to use really small containers for the bubblers, like the large size round margerine tubs. Just have an airstone in each with the plant sitting in the lid. The plants would be small enough that they could be self supporting on the lid, no net cup or medium. Only need to take 3-4 cuttings at a time.

 

They would all be fed through a Pepsi bottle style res. I'd need to give the roots regular hair cuts, and keep water and weak nutes up to the system and hopefully thats it, and I can have all the mothers I need tucked away in one little box that can easily be moved around and hidden if the need arises.

 

basic diagram of my design attached....think it could work?

 

PS - please excuse my mispelling of bonsai in the header. I don't think its possible to edit....

Edited January 25, 2009 by Oz

[white_cluster]

pipeman, I don't like it, firstly you can't do a bubbler that small, I'd try like a 60 x 40cm tub, with 6 x 100mm net pots, but in general I don't think its a good way to keep mothers, I don't like all the electrics involved, mothers are to important to risk power failure.

 

It would make the root pruning easier, but in hydro its easy anyway.

 

i think an easier system is the way to go, you could do a wick system, with a control resevoir.

 

I use these smart valve things, they are used on Autopot systems, like a float valve, but they are small and they let the tray dry out before more water goes in.

then I link up all my trays like bubblers.

 

Actually, I guess bubblers would work, I've had pumps running 3 years straight. But there is no way you could use margarine containers. I've tried to make true bonsai plants in rockwool cubes, and it doesn't work. the smallest you can keep a plant is about 20cm bush.

 

Also I got sum worries about the 11litre buckets, you'd really need to flower them early, basically more room for roots = bigger buds, faster growth, etc.... but still should be OK, my roots are fairly solid and bucket shaped by harvest time,

[pipeman]

hey white cluster, yeah I've seen those smart valves, about $35 each though, is that right? bit expensive to have in every tub. Maybe just have one smart valve in a controlling tub?

 

So with those smart valves do you have a medium in the pot? Can you explain how they are set up?

 

In terms of the plant size I reckon you can go smaller than a 20cm bush, I've seen pics at overgrow of tiny mothers. Mind you I don't think I'd want to get much smaller than 20cm anyway. Maybe 15cm.

[white_cluster]

yeah, you just have it in one tray and link the rest together, I said smart valve's cos I got 3 shelve's of mums. (only 1 and a 1/2 are full)

 

you gotta screw the thing in with a brass screw, you just screw it into your tray and silicone the bottom up, and you need medium in your pot yeah, I use perlite/vermiculite at 2:1 in little 140mm round pots.

 

I think that price is about right.

 

and yeah you can go smaller than a 20cm bush, but it would take alot of root-pruning. Basically I keep mine that size and prune em back to 15cm when needed, but I keep them stunted at that size. The smart valves are good because the roots are all in the bottom 2" or so of the pot, which limits root size as well, and I just snip bits outta that and then check again about a week later to pull out any roots I killed but didn't notice. Basically give them shit,

[pipeman]

doesn't it get messy pulling out mums in a perlite/vermiculite mix to prune roots? Thats why I thought mediumless mums would be better. Or maybe expanded clay? cleaner than and easier to reuse than perl/verm.

 

Or I could not bother to prune roots at all, just take new clones and start a new mum every few months.

 

So with this smart valve, I assume the pots have no drainage? They're just filled with water and auto refilled when the water gets to the bottom?

[white_cluster]

yeah, it is real messy, realy realy messy, my house is full of little vermiculite flakes, so yeah I guess mediumless mums would be better for that.

 

Basically, I think its a good idea now, but out in the bush were I live, when the power goes out it stays out for a long time, which could drown the roots.

But for root pruning reasons I'd go with it.

 

I think root pruning is important in the end, you can make em grow slow through no nutrients, or keeping them rootbound. or just pruning the tops alot.

 

anyhoo, the smart valve works in trays, so you just sit pots (with holes) in the trays, the trays have no drainage, I use the simple Nursery Tray's (60 x 40cm) a 2 per shelf, 6 plants in each, in 140mm pots.

[pipeman]

OK, blackouts aren't very common where I live so this isn't a major concern.

 

I'll have a think about it. Mediumless bubblers are clean, but the only thing is they promote rapid root and plant growth, which you don't really want for your mums.

 

While we're on the subject of blackouts though, I guess it would be good to discuss now, since I'm not going to be able to hop on the internet for advice when it happens.

 

So, what do you do with your bubblers in blackouts? Leave as is and hope for the best? Empty out and hand spray roots every few hours?

[white_cluster]

drain 'em to about 2", or so just the bottom roots are in there. and just lift em out and look at them every now and then.

But like I said, Its probably a waste to worry in the city, cos that power is getting fixed up quickly. I live 30k from any bitumen roads. Where you live, you'll probably finish draining your buckets when the lights come back on.

Its not much fun syphoning chemicals.

 

Are mediumless bubblers possible?? I guess they would be but its putting alot of stress on the stem, why dont you use 60mm NFT lettuce pots, they are about 30c each.

[johnnyreeferseed]

i like to bonsai myself. i have never heard of anyone using a bubbler system though. i use sterilized potting soil for mine. good article on bosai overat og from oldtimer. here are a few pics of my bosai. i just lost one to fungas knats, but the rest seem to be rebounding pretty well. i think the cure is almost as bad as the disease.

http://www.bluegrasseeds.com/ubb/image_uploads/Dsc00344.jpg

http://www.bluegrasseeds.com/ubb/image_uploads/Dsc00345.jpg

 

these bosai are about 8 months old and i have taken at least 200 clones off them.

jrs

Edited April 24, 2003 by johnnyreeferseed

[pipeman]

hey nice setup Johnny. I don't know, I'm trying to get away from soil. I'm a messy bastard, and there is soil everywhere around my grow area. Plus non organic or no medium is less likely to result in uninvited guests nesting with your mums.

 

but I really think this mediumless bubbling mum bit could work. I didn't have room for all the clones I took, so I just left four in the aero cloner to see how long I could keep them growing for. Gave them 1/4 strength nutes for 2 weeks and they're now on half strength nutes. Seem to be doing well, as they grow close to the fluoros I'll just start pruning leaves and roots.

 

I could put a second aero bubbling tray in my "rubbermaid" container, grow the plants out to twice the size they are now (which would make them big enough to take clones) and easily fit 20 or so mums in there. This is assuming of course I can keep them healthy long term in this setup, we'll see I guess...