Creating Super Stealth Mutant Bud!

[ekul]

Actually I know someone that has access to a GCMS machine. That would be the go, I think its a little on the expensive side but it would put to rest whether or not there is any colchicine in the plants. They live up in bundy so i'd have to wait till i go up there but it says on the MSDS that colchicine is a fairly stable substance so if it was in there i don;t think it would matter if i have to wait a few months till i get up there.

[brick]

Actually I know someone that has access to a GCMS machine. That would be the go, I think its a little on the expensive side but it would put to rest whether or not there is any colchicine in the plants. They live up in bundy so i'd have to wait till i go up there but it says on the MSDS that colchicine is a fairly stable substance so if it was in there i don;t think it would matter if i have to wait a few months till i get up there.

 

Well good luck to you ekul. Make sure that you let all of us know when you are going to do it, if you don't post back in here after a few months then we will know it doesn't work. Just take care.

[Bazza]

i just planted some seeds, all from the same plant and one of them is all munted and wierd. it branched out in two directions from the baby leafs and the leaves are fused together along the two stems that come out of the baby leaves. i didnt do anything to it, its in the same soil as the rest but its just a freak. i live in wa so its not bindi, dizzy or mongy. i have seen the past generations and nothing like this has happened. reading about all those americans that want dizzy is funny coz just out of the blue you can get a mutant.

[MongyMan]

This is one of those subjects that has alot of myth mixed up with facts floating around which ends up with people arguing over 'mabys'. Changing genetics with artificial means and the fact colchacine is a poison tends to make people a little wary which is quite understandable imo. Often if you dont know alot about something, it's best not to fuck with it. With the right knowledge and handled safley though, it is a very easy way to make polyploid plants. As SS said, it's used to make polyploid ornimental plants in the nursery industry.

 

Colchacine is not new to cannabis breeders. There are reports of experiments on hemp with colchacine from at least as far back as WW1 when they made polyploid plants in an attempt to increase fibre production and decrease THC levels and since then there have been numerous scientific and backyard experiments done with both hemp and narcotic strains of cannabis.

Polyploid plants often grow 20-30% larger but flower time is increased. Their seeds grow much larger than normal seeds. Leaf deformations are also common as is an increase in THC. This all sounds great but the problem is, breeding a stable polyploid strain from these plants is difficult and for reasons that are still not understood, any 'polyploid vigor' ie. the traits you are breeding for will disappear within the first generation or two anyway.

Eating plants from the treated seeds probably has little risk imo but I'm no doctor. It is used as a medicine in far larger doses than would ever be residul in the plants as you pointed out ekul. Smoking it is a different matter though as much smaller amounts of a chemical can often have catastrophic effects. Take asbestos for eg. It is possible that it isn't residul at all and there's absolutly no health risk. Only reliable testing will answer that one but in the mean time I'm erring on the side of saftey .

Breeding stable polyploid seed strains, whilst at the same time retaining the benefits of the first polyploid plants has been proven by many to be a waste of time but if it can be shown the plants from the original treated seeds contain no residule colchacine then that changes things as it would be possible to just keep mums from those first plants and take clones. Look into those tests ekul, I and I'm sure others are keen to know the results.

 

Peace MongyMan

[MongyMan]

i just planted some seeds, all from the same plant and one of them is all munted and wierd. it branched out in two directions from the baby leafs and the leaves are fused together along the two stems that come out of the baby leaves. i didnt do anything to it, its in the same soil as the rest but its just a freak.

 

Cool bazza, any chance of a pic?

 

i live in wa so its not bindi, dizzy or mongy. i have seen the past generations and nothing like this has happened. reading about all those americans that want dizzy is funny coz just out of the blue you can get a mutant.

 

Not saying your plant is a Mongy madness throwback Bazza as mutations happen fairly often in cannabis from my experience but living in wa and having not seen it in previous generations is not a reason to say that it isn't. There are people quietly growing Mongy Madness in all states of Oz now and besides these plants, there are recesive mongy genes laying hidden in alot of seed stocks, mainly in Australia but also in other countries, including Amsterdam, due to the number of people who have tried breeding with them. Ocasionaly they resurface which is usually as a single seedling in seed from plants that have grown many generations with normal looking leaves as you describe.

 

Peace MongMan

[Bazza]

hers some pics of the mutant. not very good quality, off da phone

s

 

and here is a norm sprout the same age

[67Special]

It's definitely got issues Baz ..will be interesting to see how it develops though, thanks for sharing

 

MM, are you still growing Mongy Madness? ..some comparison pics would be great

[ekul]

It sort of looks like a grub has eaten it and then has grown back baz, i've had seedlings that have looked like this before, usually ones that take ages to pop, after a while they get better and look the same as the others. I've been doing a lot of research on the net and apparently mutations are possible without using mutagens, just incredibly rare as the genes that make plants a bit on the funky side are recessive. So weird looking plants are possible but the chances of it happening are like 1 in 100000. And then to find ANOTHER plant with the same mutations so to breed them together to keep the desired charateristics is very hard. Unless you cloned it, gave one the sts treatment and went from there.

On another note. I used to work at the dpi in qld where we were doing experiments in seedless citrus. We were working at getting triploid plants by crossing a tree that had 2 sets of chromosomes with trees with 4 sets. The resultant seeds were triploid and the trees pretty much sterile(sorta like the mule of citrus!). So when the tripoid tree was pollenated most of the seed embyos would terminate resulting in practically seedless citrus. So what does this have to do with anything? Well i was thinking about the mutants that i am going to create. As these plants will have all different numbers of chromosomes the plants may not produce fertile seed. The lit that touches on this subject recommends not smoking the first generation, implying that the polyploid plants DO reproduce successfully and that subsequent generations are fine to smoke. Has anyone here actually played around with polyploidism? Did you find the polyploid plants were difficult to reproduce?

[bush buggered]

Hey all. Interesting thread. I messed around with colchesine tablets about 30 years ago. To no avail though. Did'nt do squat. I was inverting seedlings in the brew as well as soaking seeds. I got pissed of with it cos nothing startling had happened. Maybe my dosage was to weak. Who knows. Gotta add though, i always wondered if thats how bindi, mongy, claytons. or any thing else you wanna call it. eventuated.. Wattya think mongy man?.. cheers guys..b.b.

[smokinjoe]

Just the thought of mutating my plant/s thru means that aren't totally natural scares me.

 

Snake venom is totally natural Rose; could I interest you in a 30cc IV dose?

 

Don't mean to be persnickety.